Trump is in talks with Russia to end the war

[putnam6]

There are plenty of other sources for this.

This quote from this source:

"We expect the Russian side to unconditionally agree to this proposal,” said Ukraine’s Foreign Minister Andrii Sybiha ahead of the meeting. “It is time for Russia to show whether it really wants peace.”

Dislike the source and attack it if you want but that quote is not made up.

It is a fact that Ukraine wanted an unconditional 30 day ceasefire, but Russia did not agree, which was my point.

That gif is getting tiresome.

You've dismissed immediately a few links and quotes Ive posted, for being too far right. Yes?

Ive been referencing the Islamization of the United Kingdom all through the thread as a concern, it's a side effect of the whole mess.

Some posts seem kind of dismissive on that issue as well, Yes?

Ergo when you use a media source based in Qatar instead of the BBC the Daily Mail or the Metro it is ironically funny

[putnam6]

I agree, there are many other sources that agreed to that same fact and just because a source is centre-left or centre-right, does not mean those specific facts are not true. I've used sources that lean both ways.

I am really not sure what some Americans have against Ukraine here, it's baffling that they seem to be on the invader's side because...why...I just don't get it?

As for that gif, it's a tell tale sign of being unsure of one's facts, sort of like when someone is losing a debate then have to resort to insults - same thing in my eyes.

We should move on from what was, to what is and it looks like everyone needs to give Putin everything he demands if there is to be peace, but with the stipulation that the U.S. will monitor both sides via space satellite technology. I think this will work.

Respectfully I questioned the source because a few times here when I post a source and a quote I hear whinging and crying it's a too-far-right source first of all, secondly the migrant flood into the UK and Europe has been dismissed here as well. 

The use of Aljazeera.com is not only ironically funny but is evidence of the concerns JD Vance has pointed out for the UK and Europe and why the US is reevaluating its relationship. No more no less

[Oldcarpy2]

You've dismissed immediately a few links and quotes Ive posted, for being too far right. Yes?

Ive been referencing the Islamization of the United Kingdom all through the thread as a concern, it's a side effect of the whole mess.

Some posts seem kind of dismissive on that issue as well, Yes?

Ergo when you use a media source based in Qatar instead of the BBC the Daily Mail or the Metro it is ironically funny

I didn't post from that source for it's opinions, just for the one simple fact I was referring to.

Which you haven't addressed.

You dismiss the BBC etc so I can't really win.

Do you really think I am Islamified?!!!

With all due respect, that's absolute cobblers.

[quintessentone]

Respectfully I questioned the source because a few times here when I post a source and a quote I hear whinging and crying it's a too-far-right source first of all, secondly the migrant flood into the UK and Europe has been dismissed here as well. 

The use of Aljazeera.com is not only ironically funny but is evidence of the concerns JD Vance has pointed out for the UK and Europe and why the US is reevaluating its relationship. No more no less

Can we move on from this bickering about sources? It's easy enough to prove whether the facts are true or not using multiple sources and can we try to keep on topic, please?

By the way, didn't the U.K. just bomb the hell out of the Yemen, alongside the U.S.? Not sure where the Trump distancing idea is coming from.

Just watching the war news and why is the EU warning Putin not to invade or attack Poland? This is getting so weird. Unless conquering Poland would be the large jewel sitting in the front centre of Putin's imagined crown.

Watching Zelensky's address now. As I thought, he wants other countries to also monitor the sea (Turkey), air (Saudi Arabia), etc. and not leave the monitoring all up to the U.S. This is a smart move IMO.

Silence at sea and freedom of navigation is the first step, but there are many details to address and the U.S. side has not issued an official declaration.

There will be a new meeting in Paris and a Summit the next day; a meeting of countries regarding security guarantees.

New deal between the U.S. and Ukraine is coming but the details need to be completed.

[sahgwa]

I will chime in here and repeat myself again, I find it 'annoying' 'sad' 'amusing' that both sides are talking about ceasefires while continuing to bomb each other.  Just this morning and last night, after Zelenskys speech both sides hit each others infrastructures, again.

https://news.sky.com/story/ukraine-russi...t-12541713
https://www.rt.com/russia/614799-kiev-vi...y-accords/

It's like trying to chaperone toddlers. The sooner we get third party surveillance and stop the idiocy the better.

[quintessentone]

I will chime in here and repeat myself again, I find it 'annoying' 'sad' 'amusing' that both sides are talking about ceasefires while continuing to bomb each other.  Just this morning and last night, after Zelenskys speech both sides hit each others infrastructures, again.

https://news.sky.com/story/ukraine-russi...t-12541713
https://www.rt.com/russia/614799-kiev-vi...y-accords/

It's like trying to chaperone toddlers. The sooner we get third party surveillance and stop the idiocy the better.

Watching the UN Security Council and the Russian Federation Representative is denying sending drones to kill Ukrainian civilians in residential areas.

Chaperoning toddlers is accurate, but the hate may never end between the two sides.

[sahgwa]

Watching the UN Security Council and the Russian Federation Representative is denying sending drones to kill Ukrainian civilians in residential areas.

Chaperoning toddlers is accurate, but the hate may never end between the two sides.

Oh never. And its just fueled on either side by profiteers and imperialists. 
Thats why we can't really rely on either of them to actually enact a ceasefire. We need some kind of physical third party presence at this point. As much as I hate to say that.  
It worked in Kosovo. 
I am hoping for physical surveillance over physical humans.

[quintessentone]

Oh never. And its just fueled on either side by profiteers and imperialists. 
Thats why we can't really rely on either of them to actually enact a ceasefire. We need some kind of physical third party presence at this point. As much as I hate to say that.  
It worked in Kosovo. 
I am hoping for physical surveillance over physical humans.

I think Zelensky knows that, that is why he has re-ignited that resources agreement with Trump, if I understand correctly what Zelensky was speaking about. But would having American business interests on Ukrainian soil be a deterrent to Putin invading again?

Edit to add:

At the UN Security Council just listening to the Ukrainian Representative listing the strikes on hospitals, hotels, schools, residential buildings...all civilian targets.

[sahgwa]

I think Zelensky knows that, that is why he has re-ignited that resources agreement with Trump, if I understand correctly what Zelensky was speaking about. But would having American business interests on Ukrainian soil be a deterrent to Putin invading again?

I don't think enough people are trying to get into devil's advocate mode in regards to Russia and their psychology on this whole thing. The whole MO of the SMO was ostensibly to push back against NATO expansion and CIA Color Revolution, and to remove Nazis in Kiev , who were supported by 'Nazis in Washington' I think were the words of Medvedev (?) .  In their mind it was a surgical strike at regime change, against US-backed regime change,  to 'help' Ukraine be more independent from Western fascist meddling. 

That said, I don't think there would be any impetus for Russia to 'invade' Ukraine, if American business interests were on the ground in Ukraine, as long as USA helped 'clean' the government of Kiev.   The 'business interests' would just be there as a side effect of USA 'helping'  
Therefore, in this scenario, Trump would have to show Putin that he is helping to make Ukraine more independent and less staunchly Anti Russia.  so called.

[putnam6]

Yep.

If I'd used a source from "merry old England" that would get sneered at so you can't really win.

I don't get the hatred of Zelensky.

Hating Zelensky has nothing to do with it. It WAS an unwinnable war unless we were prepared to send in NATO troops, AMERICA wasn't going to, rightfully so, and even Europe and the UK are wishy-washy AF that's not how one goes to war with Russia, Bernard



All along since before the start of the SMO, my position of not wanting the US to get involved was based on it being an unwinnable meat grinder of war. A war still with no plan for victory against an army 7 times as large all the while it sucks up billions of dollars into the graft and corruption-ridden Ukraine. 

Said this in the first thread on ATS and we argued about it then too, OVER 3 YEARS AGO

This in itself warrants a J.Jonah Jameson's sarcastic laughing gif for both of us wasting time trying to convince the other, especially when even if we were to change each other's minds it wouldn't affect whatever the actual outcome will be one iota