Has Ukraine collapsed

[andy06shake]

I think it will be economic and technological.
Example - China won't want to nuke America, because
they want our farm lands.    Destroying us
through technological attack and destruction
of us economically is what they want.  Then they 
can walk in and take over.

By that same logic Flyers China wont won't to nuke Europe because that's where they sell their products, same as in the USA.

Russia on the other hand, all they have is energy/oil to export, pushing them into a corner may very well provoke a nuclear exchange. 

Esspecilly so where invasion is concerned.

[FlyersFan]

Russia on the other hand, all they have is energy/oil to export, pushing them into a corner may very well provoke a nuclear exchange. 

True.    Russia is insane.   
Putin wants the world and the Russian people believe the nationalist propaganda.   
They are 'old school' when it comes to war and very different from how China would do things.
IMHO.

[WallFlowerActive]

Thats not an answer at all. 

I would only defend my nation if its shores were invaded, that's common knowledge, and i have said so on many occasions.

Still not quite clear on what you would do? 

Elucidate please?

I was honest with you.

Now.  If the UK was down to sending children and old men into combat like WW II Germany and underwent extensive fire bombings killing 10,000s of thousands in a night.  At what point would you surrender.  I think there is a point surrender is a moot point.  If a country is collapsed, it doesn’t have the means to fight.  

Who’s the Ukraine sending into combat?  Definitely not the ones leaving and dodging forced conscription.

And I’m not even saying the Ukraine should do total surrender.  I didn’t think any sane person wants the Ukraine to totally surrender.   But might want to find a way to keep what they have before they collapse.

Again.  The general rule is an advantage 5 or 7 to one to take and hold territory.  Realistically with the Ukraine running out of manpower, how is it going to take back and hold land against the steady Russian push that is similar to the slow and steady gains allies made at the end of WW II.

[andy06shake]

I was honest with you.

No, you were not.

And i choose not to reciprocate or feed you until you answer the question.

"Would you give up and submit if Russia invades the USA?"

Answer it or point out where you did?

Otherwise, quite frankly, find someone else to attack your bridge.

[WallFlowerActive]

I would only defend my nation if its shores were invaded, that's common knowledge, and i have said so on many occasions.

Even if it resulted in WW 3 then.

But the Ukraine isn’t worth it as long as Europe got cheap energy from a ex KGB agent and arms dealers continue to get rich.  While you keep saying Putin shouldn’t be appeased.  But the Ukraine war is being ran exactly if you wanted to grift money, set the stage for kickbacks, and make arms dealers rich with giving them a theatre to develop their merchandise.



Talk about a total contradiction.

[Oldcarpy2]

I was honest with you.

Now.  If the UK was down to sending children and old men into combat like WW II Germany and underwent extensive fire bombings killing 10,000s of thousands in a night.  At what point would you surrender.  I think there is a point surrender is a moot point.  If a country is collapsed, it doesn’t have the means to fight.  

Who’s the Ukraine sending into combat?  Definitely not the ones leaving and dodging forced conscription.

And I’m not even saying the Ukraine should do total surrender.  I didn’t think any sane person wants the Ukraine to totally surrender.   But might want to find a way to keep what they have before they collapse.

Again.  The general rule is an advantage 5 or 7 to one to take and hold territory.  Realistically with the Ukraine running out of manpower, how is it going to take back and hold land against the steady Russian push that is similar to the slow and steady gains allies made at the end of WW II.

Yeah, right.  It'll all be over by Christmas?  But, which year?

And, how long before Russian desertion rates impact Putin's fantasy War?

[WallFlowerActive]

No, you were not.

Have you ever served.  Part of command is knowing when to fight, and when it’s suicide.  Pushing the Ukraine to buy weapons to do what?  Fight until surrender becomes a moot point like for Japan or Germany in WW II?  Instead of trying to find a way to keep the land they still have.  Anything else is suicide, and just lining pockets of arms dealers while Europe and the US isn’t going to be an actual allies.

[andy06shake]

Have you ever served.  Part of command is knowing when to fight, and when it’s suicide.  Pushing the Ukraine to buy weapons to do what?  Fight until surrender becomes a moot point like for Japan or Germany in WW II?  Instead of trying to find a way to keep the land they still have.  Anything else is suicide, and just lining pockets of Europe and the US isn’t going to be an actual allies.

Yadda yadda yadda.

More Kremlin talking points.

Cherry picks parts of posts.

Still can't answer basic questions.

You are already aware of what you have been asked to provide if you wish dialogue to continue.

See i can be obtuse also.  

And that's all she wrote. 

[WallFlowerActive]

Yeah, right.  It'll all be over by Christmas?  But, which year?

And, how long before Russian desertion rates impact Putin's fantasy War?

And yet men in the Ukraine continue dying while Russia is gaining territory week to week.

You are ignoring the reality.  I’m laying out how the Ukraine can fight to get its land back.  It takes a 5 or 7 to one advantage to recapture and hold land.  How does the Ukraine get the manpower to get its land back.  What strategy is going to lead to the Ukraine recapturing its land.  Supposedly there was going to be a great Ukraine campaign two summers ago with Russians just giving up and Putin dying from a mystery illness.  That hasn’t happen either.

[Oldcarpy2]

Even if it resulted in WW 3 then.

But the Ukraine isn’t worth it as long as Europe got cheap energy from a ex KGB agent and arms dealers continue to get rich.  While you keep saying Putin shouldn’t be appeased.  But the Ukraine war is being ran exactly if you wanted to grift money, set the stage for kickbacks, and make arms dealers rich with giving them a theatre to develop their merchandise.



Talk about a total contradiction.

Arms dealers?

The US is charging Europe for it's weapons for Ukraine.

So, if your Country was invaded, would you bend over and take it, or not?

It's a yes or no question.