3rd shooting in Minnesota.

[Kurokage]

He was being combative and was armed.

Those are facts that cannot be disputed.

When you are armed and combative towards federal agents, you are putting your life on the line as well as everyone around you.

So by those standards, you think Kyle Rittenhouse should've been shot?

[UltraBudgie]

Good.

Im glad we got this outta the way for the next few dozen American deaths.

Precedent and all.

As if there isn't enough precedent?

Armed cops kill innocent people.
Unarmed cops kill innocent people.
Lack of cops kills innocent people.
Life kills innocent people.

Now, there must always be the standard: "do better". ICE, and other agencies must be tasked, now and continuously with the following:
* Do your job with less harm to the public
* Do your job with more benefit to the public
* Do your job more

It will always be imperfect. That's no excuse. And the piper must be paid, as he always must. There will be lawsuits, and firings, just and unjust.

In this particular case, I think it is correct that ICE should not be tasked with both executing warrants and targeted arrests and crowd control. Lacking local police support, other federal forces must be brought to bear, such as the law allows. They need to step it up.

[CriticalStinker]

Hs had no ID and no permit on him.

Wonder why . . . . . . . .

A petty misdemeanor. 

So while that is a crime, again, not capital punishment. Not even a felony. But you bring people to court for that. You don't mag dump on them while they're face down with hands shown. 

And again, there are plenty of protests where people on the right show up to with guns. I don't think I ever would. I've never even been to a protest. But that doesn't change what is and isn't legal... Or the fact we charge people for crimes unless they're actively putting someone else's life in danger. There was no indication here he intended to use the firearm.

[SteamyAmerican]

As if there isn't enough precedent?

Armed cops kill innocent people.
Unarmed cops kill innocent people.
Lack of cops kills innocent people.
Life kills innocent people.

Now, there must always be the standard: "do better". ICE, and other agencies must be tasked, now and continuously with the following:
* Do your job with less harm to the public
* Do your job with more benefit to the public
* Do your job more

It will always be imperfect. That's no excuse. And the piper must be paid, as he always must. There will be lawsuits, and firings, just and unjust.

In this particular case, I think it is correct that ICE should not be tasked with both executing warrants and targeted arrests and crowd control. Lacking local police support, other federal forces must be brought to bear, such as the law allows. They need to step it up.

Agreed. But. Not happening.

See: hiring practices See:lack of training See: demonized by public opinion See: DHS & Noem deflecting and running cover for all instances of violent encounters See:Trump making them out to be heroes See:endless targets Etc. etc.

ICE is like the epitome of how people always say cops were picked on in high school.

Now they can kill indiscriminately while performing their “job”.

Pretty insidious.

[DBCowboy]

So by those standards, you think Kyle Rittenhouse should've been shot?

Was he interfering and being combative with law enforcement?  No.

Apples/oranges

[rickymouse]

I must be an old timer, if the cops or any federal agent were to tell me to put my hands up, I would do it.  Even when I was drinking I was always cooperative.  By resisting arrest you automatically make things worse, if you interfere with them arresting a person, you make it worse.  Are people that nuts nowadays that they believe it is sane or normal to be blocking law enforcement from doing their job. 

Take the fight to court, do not mess with the people who are just doing their job and trying to make it home after their shift ends.  This is way more insane than the protests back in the sixties and seventies by the hippies and my generation.  i Was part of some of those smaller protests locally, they were mostly peaceful, people who did try to cause trouble were on their own.  Yes, there were riots in some cities, and I wanted no part of those.  

After being in some of the protests I was in, I discovered that the reason for those protests were mostly personal, the instigators who started them had a personal gripe or in one case was a paid person to start a conflict to drive the locals to actually back the logging industry the protest was supposedly against.  It was a staged setup and some equipment was sabataged, I learned this from the person who got paid to do that, locals actually backed the loggers more after the protest too.

That person who got shot should not have done what he was doing.  Peacceful protests are legal, but that guy was not being peaceful and he should not have been carrying a gun with what was going on there...that put a target on his back...That was not a very smart thing to do.  I refrain from calling people dumb or stupid, I prefer to say they did something not very smart because even a smart person does stupid things sometimes.....Like me commenting on this thread right now.

[Kurokage]

Hs had no ID and no permit on him.

Wonder why . . . . . . . .

Oh, so not having his papers on him when demanded for is also a death sentence. I think that was tried else where???

I remember the days on ATS when people argued that the right to carry and bear arms was for when a government started treading on their rights??

so you're now saying his shouldn't have been carrying a weapon?? hmmmmmm....

the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed

[UltraBudgie]

Now they can kill indiscriminately while performing their “job”.

Pretty insidious.

If you think that, what you're asking for is either a lawless nation, or for ICE to engage with local law enforcement (one way or another).

In fact, not a nation at all any more, as the established "law of the nation" will have been overridden by state whim, and that is the fundamental thing that binds a union. It's no exaggeration so say that if federal law becomes subordinate to state action, there is no more USA.

But do keep up your cheerfully bald-faced optimism.

[Kurokage]

Was he interfering and being combative with law enforcement?  No.

Apples/oranges

I think you mean Democrat/Republican don't you?

[DBCowboy]

I think you mean Democrat/Republican don't you?

No.