The Great Flood — Myth, Memory, or Something In Between?

[chr0naut]

People can't read the bible like it's a single big history book.
It's 73 separate books under one cover. 
46 in the Old Testament and 27 in the New Testament.
Some is myth.  Some is poetry.  Some is history.  Some is allegory.
And always gotta' keep in mind ... the history is told from the point
of view of the Hebrews so it's biased.

The canonical Bible has 66 books. The reason some books are considered apocryphal, and not included in the canon, is that there is some doubt about their content's validity as being the inspired Word of God.

And I have physics textbooks that use metphor and simile (like Einstein's elevator examples for explaining relativistic reference frames, or the 'rubber sheet' metaphor for visualizing gravitational wells). So, should we consider those science textbooks entirely allegorical, and untrustworthy for learning from? Should one throw the baby out with the bathwater? Exactly where does one draw the distinction?

Generally if the Bible says that something is like something else, it is saying that it isn't actually the same, but just similar. But if the Bible says that something is something else, then it is saying that they are the same. Do you see how language works? In this way, one can easily determine what is poetic, or allegorical, from what is not.

Too many people don't bother to differentiate, and then they go off debunking things that are not actually recorded as being factual in the Bible.

[FlyersFan]

The canonical Bible has 66 books. 

That's the Protestant bible.
They are missing a few books.
There are 73 canonical books in the Catholic bible.
(which is the original bible)

[chr0naut]

From an earlier post, you contend that the Genesis Flood was local to the Levant. Other posters contend that the Genesis story was retooled from the Mesopotamian stories. Your position and the other both claim that the flood was local, not global.

But have you read how the flood is written about in 2 Peter? I've read it over three times in the last couple of days. The author seems to be a fundamentalist with a high confidence in the factuality of what he read in Genesis. Here is what he wrote in chapter 3:

According to him the World perished. I'm pretty sure that the 1st or 2nd century author was aware of a World larger than the Levant, or even bigger than the whole Roman Empire.

The word that the WEB has translated as "world" in 2 Peter 3:6 actually transliterates to "kosmos" (Strongs G2889), in the earliest Koine Greek texts. In context with the use of the word in 1 Peter3:3, by the same author, the meaning of the word 'kosmos' in this instance (according to Thayer's Greek Lexicon) is "ornament, decoration, adornment, i.e. the arrangement of the stars, 'the heavenly hosts', as the ornament of the heavens".

A more general translation of "kosmos" would be 'the universe'.

However, the point being made in 2 Peter 3 is about people denying that Christ will return because it wasn't immediate, and that there will be judgement. Specifically, 'back then' the judgement was by flood, but in the future, judgement will be by fire.

The generality of possible meanings of the word "kosmos" in that passage is more for narrative purposes underlining the primary point of the text. I don't think you can say it specifically and only means 'the planet', as you seem to have interpreted it to mean.

Again, this underlines the importance of choosing an accurate translation that best captures what the author intended to say. This was the topic thread of the OP.

Studying the wording of a translation of a translation, and reading it as if it were the original text, leads to frequent errors in interpretation.

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And the generations of Noah are in Genesis 5:28-32, 9:18-19, 29. Abram's genealogy is Genesis 11: 10-26. You can go by the ages at birth of son to figure out how long after Adam that the supposed worldwide flood happened and then how long after the flood Abram was. That's how the Bishop Ussher dating get's figured.

Genesis 5:28-32 is the Toledot of Adam.

Genesis 9 mentions the sons of Noah coming out of the ark, and Noah's death. The mentions are more narrative, than geneological.

Genesis 11:10-26 is the toledot of Shem.

I know how Ussher determined his dating of Genesis events. I have no way of knowing if his dating is accurate however, if you try and align the Exodus in his chronology with what is currently known of Egyptian records relating to their history, king lists and wars, Usshers dating is too late (closer to our current time) than current estimates.

[Maxmars]

I am about to post something that could be considered heretical, I suppose. 
Since it isn't something the dictionary or AI would say...

The Bible... itself, is a human representation of a faith.

It is not a "book" - it does not serve simply as a repository of data, it inspires.
It is not even a collection of books - because we excommunicated equally
important works, for the sake of editorial consistency, and personal bias...

The Bible is supposed to, and I believe it does, offer us the word of God.

It is a vehicle... nothing more.

The word lives in the heart...
the heart sometimes imitates God... judging.

When people attack the Bible as a "book."  
It entirely misses the message.

[3rdrockfrmsun]

That's the Protestant bible.
They are missing a few books.
There are 73 canonical books in the Catholic bible.
(which is the original bible)

You’re right — the Catholic Old Testament draws from the Septuagint, but the Orthodox canon actually preserves more of it in full. In that sense, the Orthodox Bible reflects the broader set of writings used by the earliest Christian communities before the two churches split and Western canon was finalized.

[Wild Bill]

I stopped when I saw they were talking about something that supposedly happened in the last 200 years and left no records.
The 1775 Lisbon earthquake was exactly 250 years (and 10 days) ago and has lots of references from all around Europe, how could something supposedly so big like that "mud flood" could happen with no records at all?


I don't understand, how is that relevant to the topic?  


I like to read, could you be more specific about what I should read?

On a building site nearly 40  years ago Armap a 30 ton tracked digger fell into a sink hole that opened up  , I run over to investigate and what I witnessed scared me more than sitting at the top of that crane smoking a joint .

I get the Tom cruise film oblivion now    looking down inside a massive building realising that you are standing on a wall inside of a building as floors well below me collapsed down , And that is in no history books either ,  plus don't forget the average person even 150 years ago could not write and most were out to work at 8 years old  , 160 or so years ago one of my religious family dragged a member of his congregation  out of his bed for missing church because he had to much to drink  on a Saturday night and the congregation burned him to death ! Ikyn  , and this was in what they call the age of enlightenment in Edinburgh Scotland.

[andy06shake]

[FlyersFan]

I don't know how to post images.
So I'm going to experiment .... 

 

Well ... it didn't work.
Someone has to teach me how to post images.  

[andy06shake]

I don't know how to post images.
So I'm going to experiment .... 

 [Image: https://i.redd.it/u1elxeommko71.jpg]

Well ... it didn't work.
Someone has to teach me how to post images.  

https://i.redd.it/u1elxeommko71.jpg

Ile DM you and walk you through the process if you like?

[Roma]

Noah, know as Nuh, is also mentioned in the Quran.  I think there may be some differences to the story but interesting the religion of Islam also recorded the event of the flood and regards him as a prophet.