Multiple Russian Tu-95 bombers burning a massive Ukrainian FPV drone strike

[putnam6]

Disgusted and conspiracy leaning minds who were hoping this BS would have ended by now, view the ongoing push as nothing less than money-grubbing by the MIC but even more so, as the perfect testing ground for said 'new forms ' of drone warfare and defences against such. 
It's also 'tangentially' perfectly timed to tie into AI systems training in war.   Why stop now?
asshols.

Well, if we were to do a roll call on all factions involved, Russian leaders, Ukrainian leaders, NATO leaders, none of those are ready for peace, nor do the Russian GP or the Ukrainian GP want peace. We know the MIC-owned American politicians don't want peace either.

So here we are...

[Zaphod58]

Well, if we were to do a roll call on all factions involved, Russian leaders, Ukrainian leaders, NATO leaders, none of those are ready for peace, nor do the Russian GP or the Ukrainian GP want peace. We know the MIC-owned American politicians don't want peace either.

So here we are...

If your neighbor built a house on your land and claimed it as theirs would you be happy with letting them have it? We learned the hard way that appeasement doesn’t work, so letting Russia keep what they have just emboldens them to take more later. And Russia can’t lose face by withdrawing.

[Oldcarpy2]

Disgusted and conspiracy leaning minds who were hoping this BS would have ended by now, view the ongoing push as nothing less than money-grubbing by the MIC but even more so, as the perfect testing ground for said 'new forms ' of drone warfare and defences against such. 
It's also 'tangentially' perfectly timed to tie into AI systems training in war.   Why stop now?
asshols.

Yep.  Disgusting that those Ukrainians actually took action against bombers that had been launching deadly attacks against them.  How very dare them.

Meanwhile, Putin carries out daily and increased attacks on civilians.  How dare they resist.

Putin started this, has no intention of stopping yet Ukraine are the bad guys.

Appeasement simply is a Very Bad Thing.

[Oldcarpy2]

More images of the results of the drone strikes:


BBC News - Satellite images show Russian bombers destroyed in Ukraine attack
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cvg9zdxwk29o
Now, how will Russia respond?

[sahgwa]

Let's all cheer on the war ra ra ra ra Go plucky Ukraine defend your homeland that has nothing to do with Russia whatsoever!
Down with Russia booo evil evil they have nothing of worth for the world whatsoever!
Hail Bayer Hail Haliburton Hail Northrup Grumman Hail Rheinmetall Hail Thales Group Hail the Final Victory!
I hope Ukraine keeps fighting till the last Russian is dead and Ukraine is a blasted wasteland with empty land for my Glorious Corporate Overlords to occupy Build Back Better.
Sorry for the outburst. ahem.

[CriticalStinker]

Let's all cheer on the war ra ra ra ra Go plucky Ukraine defend your homeland that has nothing to do with Russia whatsoever!
Down with Russia booo evil evil they have nothing of worth for the world whatsoever!
Hail Bayer Hail Haliburton Hail Northrup Grumman Hail Rheinmetall Hail Thales Group Hail the Final Victory!
I hope Ukraine keeps fighting till the last Russian is dead and Ukraine is a blasted wasteland with empty land for my Glorious Corporate Overlords to occupy Build Back Better.
Sorry for the outburst. ahem.

Yea, they should just stop trying to keep their sovereignty. Super selfish of them for not wanting to be absorbed by a hostile nation.

We tried to do ceasefires and even offered Russia the land they held, that wasn't enough. What do you suggest Ukraine do?

[Oldcarpy2]

Let's all cheer on the war ra ra ra ra Go plucky Ukraine defend your homeland that has nothing to do with Russia whatsoever!
Down with Russia booo evil evil they have nothing of worth for the world whatsoever!
Hail Bayer Hail Haliburton Hail Northrup Grumman Hail Rheinmetall Hail Thales Group Hail the Final Victory!
I hope Ukraine keeps fighting till the last Russian is dead and Ukraine is a blasted wasteland with empty land for my Glorious Corporate Overlords to occupy Build Back Better.
Sorry for the outburst. ahem.

Wow.  Those horrible Ukrainians, defending themselves against a War criminal tryingto invade, kill, and subjugate them.

How very dare they?


But, but, Nuland, MIC, and so on.....

[putnam6]

If your neighbor built a house on your land and claimed it as theirs would you be happy with letting them have it? We learned the hard way that appeasement doesn’t work, so letting Russia keep what they have just emboldens them to take more later. And Russia can’t lose face by withdrawing.

3 Plus years and Ive heard that analogy way too much...  here's an article from 2016 that deserves some reflection now, plug in Mexico instead of Ukraine, and plug in Xi Ping for Biden, and other high-ranking Chinese politicians and bureaucrats, and when you see, McCain, and Nuland 

Everyone ought to read the whole article; this doesn't excuse or in any way justify Putin's invasion, but it explains the Russian viewpoint very well. This was 2016, and American politicians and bureaucrats were all up in Ukraine's business, LOL Vice President Joe Biden had stated that he talks with Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko more often than he does with his wife, in an awkward mix of joke and admission of Washington’s involvement in Kiev.

IF CHINA DID THIS IN MEXICO CITY? What's the American response? Isn't that a much more accurate and realistic analogy

So let's time travel back to February 2016, Trump has been President for a month, and he has been impeached twice and has 78 injunctions already filed against him....meanwhile in UKRAINE 

https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/the-heartbreaking-irony-of-winter-on-fire/

Protesters clash with police in central Kiev, Ukraine, Wednesday, January 22, 2014.(AP Photo / Efrem Lukatsky, file)

 

The darkest evidence of the far right’s involvement comes from Ivan Katchanovski, a professor at the University of Ottawa, who researched the events of February 20, 2014, “Maidan snipers massacre” when mysterious gunmen killed over 50 people. In addition to being the crucial turning point that led to Yanukovych’s abdication, the massacre is the climax of Winter on Fire. Katchanovski argues, with considerable forensic and other evidence, that far-right groups not only provoked fighting by shooting at the police but also carried out the murder of Maidan protesters in a false-flag operation. The Kiev government has been unable to provide a definitive explanation to what happened that day.
The far right’s absence from Winter on Fire becomes even more glaring when compared with other documentaries about Ukraine. Maidan: Tonight Tomorrow, which received a positive review in The New Yorker, managed to include the far right, despite being less than nine minutes long, while Masks of the Revolution, a French film, focused solely on the role of ultranationalists during and after Maidan. (Ironically, the Ukrainian government attempted to prevent France from airing the latter film because they claimed it “creates misconception.”)


Without the neo-Nazi groups, Maidan would not have succeeded in overthrowing Ukraine’s elected president—the titular “winter on fire” would have sputtered out. And yet the film makes no mention of them. (A frame-by-frame scrutiny revealed some background flashes of flags and insignia, an interviewee wearing a scarf with Bandera’s image, and two scenes with Tyahnybok milling about in the background, but none of this would hold any meaning for an American viewer.) The fact that Evgeny Afineevsky, the film’s director, chose to ignore the very factor that made his film possible is astonishing.

 
Another gross distortion in Winter on Fire is its presentation of Maidan as an independent phenomenon free of Western interference. While the film makes much of the ties between the Yanukovych government and Moscow, it portrays the protest movement as spontaneous, grassroots, and, above all, beholden to no foreign interests. Visiting American politicians appear in a single ten-second scene when they, according to the intertitle, “meet with Yanukovych in order to find a diplomatic solution to the current crisis.”
Evidence, however, demonstrates that America’s role during the winter turmoil of 2013–14 was more quarterback than arbiter. The most telling example of this comes via an intercepted phone call between US Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland and Washington’s ambassador to Ukraine, Geoffrey Pyatt. During the call, Nuland and Pyatt sound like two senior managers hashing out corporate restructuring, with Nuland instructing Pyatt on which Ukrainian leader should be appointed prime minister, how to sideline the UN and the EU in negotiations, and the best strategy for making Ukraine land “jelly side up,” as an enthusiastic Pyatt described it.
 
The call, which was leaked on February 4, 2014, was not the first time Nuland and Pyatt were deeply involved in Maidan. On December 11, 2013, the pair made a highly publicized tour of the barricades handing out cookies to protesters. Three days later, Senator John McCain flew in to speak to the crowds; McCain and Senator Chris Murphy shared the stage with Svoboda leader Tyahnybok. Both visits were filmed by Ukrainian and Western press, yet are absent from the documentary. Understandably, the involvement of senior US government officials working to land Ukraine “jelly side up” interfered with the “everyday people, teachers, doctors, street cleaners” narrative of Winter on Fire.

 The “alternative viewpoints” excluded by Afineevsky are, of course, the opinions of the roughly 22 million Ukrainians who were against the Maidan uprising, as reported by Kyiv Post (a pro-Maidan publication) in December 2013. To put this decision into perspective, imagine a foreign filmmaker creating a glowing documentary about the NRA called America’s Fight for Freedom while ignoring the alternative viewpoints of millions of Americans who strongly oppose the NRA.

 
In addition to brutally crushing dissent in southeastern Ukraine, the far-right paramilitaries racked up a horrifying record of human-rights violations. Several far-right battalions have been accused of torture, kidnapping, murder, and war crimes by Amnesty International. At times, the paramilitaries have turned on the government, clashing with police and guardsmen with deadly consequences; as commentators pointed out, Kiev’s control over these armed ultranationalists is tenuous at best.

On the political front, Nuland’s and Pyatt’s machinations left Ukraine under considerable US influence. According to respected Ukrainian investigative reporter Sergei Leschenko, as quoted by Bloomberg columnist Leonid Bershidsky, “Pyatt and the U.S. administration have more influence than ever in the history of independent Ukraine.” Last August, Pyatt and Nuland watched over the Ukrainian parliament grudgingly vote in favor of an unpopular amendment, the passage of which required considerable American arm twisting. Vice President Joe Biden has stated that he talks with Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko more often than he does with his wife, in an awkward mix of joke and admission of Washington’s involvement in Kiev.
 
Toward the end of Winter on Fire, a young activist says: “For 23 years, we only had our independence on paper, but now…it has become real.” As of late 2015, the US-backed Kiev government has an approval rating below that of former President Yanukovych before his overthrow, as increasing omens of growing public disillusionment with the Maidan government and the danger of a far-right coup grow. It appears that, much as in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Libya, the seeds of US democracy have not found fertile ground in Kiev.
And that is the heartbreaking irony of Winter on Fire. The documentary, like much Western coverage of Ukraine, chooses to present the West with a mythical, whitewashed version of the Maidan “revolution” as a movement composed solely of democratic, freedom loving people. Now the elements ignored by this myth are threatening the possibility of a free democratic Ukraine.

Like Ive posted earlier in other threads, America will have no problem with Russia now or later, Ukraine has exposed them #1

 #2 Let's not pretend IF China did in Mexico City what McCain, Nuland, Biden etc, and others did in Kyiv and elsewhere in Ukraine, America would go absolutely bug chit.

As for Russia, they can barely take Ukraine, BUT it's to NATO's and every other European nation's best interest to let them expend military troops and resources in Ukraine. If they get a wild hair for a NATO adventure, they wouldn't get far regardless

Russia will be easier to beat if they and America face off sans proxies in the next 5-7 years.

Here's a link to Masks of the Revolution, the French film that Zelensky's Ukraine doesn't want anybody to see.

Watch if you dare to DENY IGNORANCE

[RickyD]

If your neighbor built a house on your land and claimed it as theirs would you be happy with letting them have it? We learned the hard way that appeasement doesn’t work, so letting Russia keep what they have just emboldens them to take more later. And Russia can’t lose face by withdrawing.

If you're enemy tried to recruit your neighbor to let them live in their house so they could fuck with you more than they already do would you just say oh well? Then that neighbor starts attacking your friends and killing them because now they don't like you either would you just say oh well nothing I can do?

It seems like everyone wants to ignore the west and specifically the US having their hands all over the coup and new government in Ukraine. We were all up in it...and thought they wouldn't push back...then they do and everyone cries foul. If this happened to the US in say Mexico or Cuba or another neighbor we wouldn't stand for it either. What do you think we would do about it...certainly nothing "legal". I would expect assassinations and covert actions at first...if that didn't work we would manufacture a reason to invade.

Sure seems like thats what Russia did here and I don't blame them. It sucks for Ukrainians to have been used as pawns like they were and now they are paying the price for it while the west sits back watching the mess.

[CriticalStinker]

3 Plus years and Ive heard that analogy way too much...  here's an article from 2016 that deserves some reflection now, plug in Mexico instead of Ukraine, and plug in Xi Ping for Biden, and other high-ranking Chinese politicians and bureaucrats, and when you see, McCain, and Nuland 

Everyone ought to read the whole article; this doesn't excuse or in any way justify Putin's invasion, but it explains the Russian viewpoint very well. This was 2016, and American politicians and bureaucrats were all up in Ukraine's business, LOL Vice President Joe Biden had stated that he talks with Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko more often than he does with his wife, in an awkward mix of joke and admission of Washington’s involvement in Kiev.

IF CHINA DID THIS IN MEXICO CITY? What's the American response? Isn't that a much more accurate and realistic analogy

So let's time travel back to February 2016, Trump has been President for a month, and he has been impeached twice and has 78 injunctions already filed against him....meanwhile in UKRAINE 

https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/the-heartbreaking-irony-of-winter-on-fire/

[Image: https://denyignorance.com/uploader/image...an_ap_.jpg]Protesters clash with police in central Kiev, Ukraine, Wednesday, January 22, 2014.(AP Photo / Efrem Lukatsky, file)

 

Like Ive posted earlier in other threads, America will have no problem with Russia now or later, Ukraine has exposed them #1

 #2 Let's not pretend IF China did in Mexico City what McCain, Nuland, Biden etc, and others did in Kyiv and elsewhere in Ukraine, America would go absolutely bug chit.

As for Russia, they can barely take Ukraine, BUT it's to NATO's and every other European nation's best interest to let them expend military troops and resources in Ukraine. If they get a wild hair for a NATO adventure, they wouldn't get far regardless

Russia will be easier to beat if they and America face off sans proxies in the next 5-7 years.

Here's a link to Masks of the Revolution, the French film that Zelensky's Ukraine doesn't want anybody to see.

Watch if you dare to DENY IGNORANCE

[Video: https://youtu.be/6VO0f43dcLQ?si=wFqSK25CLI_gsZ2c]

To be fair, China and Russia do in fact play their games in South America, especially in Venezuela.

Also, in terms of who "did the coup", Ukraine had elected their leader to help them into the EU, it's what he ran on. At the very last minute he had a meeting with Putin and pulled out. So Russia was meddling as well, and that's when the Ukrainians started to protest. I don't doubt that we helped in that, but I'm sure they saw their neighbors who left the Russian sphere of influence to do better like Poland and wanted a taste.