Trump and Epstein were great buddies

[chr0naut]

Ive been waiting for Trump's conviction since the first impeachment hearing, all that quasi-stuck was E. Carroll's accusations... thats it, yet how many times have the Democrats portrayed damning evidence in less than solid cases being filed that had no merit. 

Trump's two impeachments - The Mueller report - His convictions for fraud - His convction for rape - The convictions of the Trump organization (of which he was sole director the time), aren't good enough for you?

These were real trials, for real crimes, with evidence, testimony, judge, jury, official transcripts and all that 'legal stuff'.

...and some of them had nothing to do with, his Presidency or politics.

Ive expected Trump to be caught in some malfeasance by now, and once there's REAL evidence,
Im for an indictment, trial, and conviction if it's deemed to be just by a 12-person jury

That has already happened, he has been convicted in courts on real evidence. But he always denies stuff and doubles down on his lies. And he has leigions of toadies who immediately make excuses for every time he is caught out.

In the Mueller Report, Trump was not exonerated. And the foreign meddling with the election bit was true (in fact, there were millions of social media posts, the dissolution of Cambridge Analytica for its part, and there were several convictions of people in Trump's campaign inner circle). He was not prosecuted because he was the President at the time, not because he was found innocent.

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So pardon my skepticism, when the Democrats track record on producing records of Trump's malfeasance is so poor. 

Why are you listening to anything Ghislaine or Epstein said? They can not be trusted 

I don't trust them. I also don't trust Trump, and I have far more evidence of his lies, so, there's that.

Epstein said 

And this is in a thread about Trump and Epstein being best buddies, which is it?

They were best buddies and did stuff together lots. Then Trump went megalomaniac, and Epstein posed a threat.

If you have evidence on Trump, produce it, indict him, try him, convict him, Im for that 100% and let the country move on.

INSTEAD, the Democrats will slow-play it through the midterms.

It's the only ammunition left that could damage Trump, the Epstein files, and it's not the files themselves, but just the suspicion of Trump's guilt hidden in the redactions 

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Bill is signed, looking forward to seeing the evidence...

Im fine with President Vance,

Trump has this tendency to throw everyone close to him under the bus. If Trump goes down, he won't go quietly.

This is where Democrats will say Trump is redacting files, scrubbing files, and recreating as if Democrats or a hostile FBI Director never controlled the files, and they were clean and pristine before.

Trump says they are saying that, but they aren't saying that.

We don't know, but we do know Epstein was convicted under Trump's administration. If Epstein had damaging evidence, why not use it against Trump to taint his indictment and conviction

Well (since Trump made similar claims about himself not being convicted), Epstein never even got to court. He was suicided beforehand. So Epstein wasn't convicted (this time).

But tell me, have you heard the Clintons denying the flight logs, or their associations with Epstein?

If the Democrats were running some sort of hoax accusations against Trump, why haven't they distanced themselves from it? Hmmm?

Yet Trump rolls out the accusations against the Clintons, in regard to Epstein, nearly every week, for years.

But he omits to mention that he attended the same social events, and flew on the same plane.

What, wait, doesn't it seem weird that Trump says he hated the guy, and didn't associate with him, yet, at the same time, he's tooling around on Epsteins private plane - at least 4 times that we can definately be sure of (probably more if they were doing 'off the record' stuff)?

Trump's excuses are transparently flimsy and contradictory. It's the stupidity of Trump's repeated verbatim excuses that are, for me, the most damning evidence against him.

DENY DENY DENY.

[cherokeetroy]

Cherokee...  My answer to your question, although it was not directed at me, is Trump will solve these accusations as he always has.  Litigation.  Trump has already won so many millions against his accusers that lie to the country.  

That is how he plans to stop it.  Drain the liars bank accounts to zero.  That should shut them up and never try to do so again.

And let the fake media like ABC, and NBC continue to lie about Trump, and pay for his retirement funds, so he may laugh at them on his golf courses as he tee's off the next ball.  

All these idiots still think they can lie about Trump, and his administration until the cows come home.  Hey... continue to go for it!  It just gets funnier each time, and Trump gets richer, and richer.

73's to all

Trump is going to solve the accusations by having his FBI & DOJ plant fake evidence to frame high profile Democrats?

If this is the agenda of his investigation upon finding "new information" then Trump can't claim victimhood, anymore. He's an active participant in criminal behavior

[chr0naut]

Trump is going to solve the accusations by having his FBI & DOJ plant fake evidence to frame high profile Democrats?

If this is the agenda of his investigation upon finding "new information" then Trump can't claim victimhood, anymore. He's an active participant in criminal behavior

Actually, if I recall correctly, Trump made those original accusations that he is blaming the Democrats for.

[CriticalStinker]

Actually, if I recall correctly, Trump made those original accusations that he is blaming the Democrats for.

2015, he talked about Epstein's island.

He could have leaned into that, saying he tried to tell people. Now Maxwell is getting special treatment stoking the flames for people going after him.

A lot of this was just really bad execution on his admins part. Bondi could have never passed out those BS binders, and we wouldn't be here right now.

[putnam6]

Trump is going to solve the accusations by having his FBI & DOJ plant fake evidence to frame high profile Democrats?

If this is the agenda of his investigation upon finding "new information" then Trump can't claim victimhood, anymore. He's an active participant in criminal behavior

I don't know how anybody takes what Trump says at face value, especially on the Epstein BS.  So either he is bluffing with new info, he is fabricating new info, or they really have new info. I think he is bluffing with new information to see who it may rattle

Is he gonna have others lie for him on thier government salaries, all the while all of Congress will be perusing the files looking for bullshit just like this. The first sentence that is the "new information" will be dissected by friends and foes alike, all looking for the damning piece or evidence against OMB, or the piece that exonerates him, and who else it may implicate.

So how many people will he have to buy off?  A man, like Trump, trusts very few people, and I don't think he inspires that kind of personal loyalty. I really don't; he burns through staff members

If one wrong person finds out this grand scheme, it goes to MSNBC, and Maddow comes on the screen with her frowny face, and the gig is up

Without details of who, what how, it sounds like Captain Quig and his strawberries.

You've been plugged in as long as anybody.  Spell it out if you want to convince people.

It feels like Trump's just shaking the tree to see what falls out, at the moment.

[chr0naut]

2015, he talked about Epstein's island.

He could have leaned into that, saying he tried to tell people. Now Maxwell is getting special treatment stoking the flames for people going after him.

A lot of this was just really bad execution on his admins part. Bondi could have never passed out those BS binders, and we wouldn't be here right now.

In 2015, Trump says that he hadn't associated with Epstein for 15 years. How, then, did he know the 'criminal secret stuff' that went on, on the island?

Could Trump be admitting, back in 2015, that he was on the Epstein client list?

[UltraBudgie]

Y'all keep calling it a 'client list'.

The folk Epstein let frolic with his girls weren't clients.

They were his product.

[putnam6]

Trump's two impeachments - The Mueller report - His convictions for fraud - His convction for rape - The convictions of the Trump organization (of which he was sole director the time), aren't good enough for you?

Yeah, I'll punt this old business to Grok AI; this shit has been gone over so much here on ATS and elsewhere

Ive read and completely agree with its assertions and conclusions, and highlighted the pertinent points
 

 
 
Let's break this down point by point, sticking to the verifiable facts about each item you mentioned. I'll clarify what actually happened in each case, including the nature of the proceedings (civil vs. criminal, political vs. judicial), outcomes, and current status as of late 2025. The goal here isn't to defend or attack anyone—it's to ensure we're working from accurate information. Many of these have been misrepresented in public discourse, so context matters.
 
1. Trump's Two Impeachments

• These were congressional proceedings under the U.S. Constitution (Article I, Sections 2-3), not criminal trials in a court of law. The House votes to impeach (like an indictment), and the Senate holds a trial leading to potential removal from office. There's no judge, jury, or enforceable criminal penalties—it's a political process.
  
• Outcomes: Impeached by the House in 2019 (Ukraine aid) and 2021 (January 6), but acquitted by the Senate both times (52-48 and 57-43 votes, respectively). No removal from office.
  
• Relevance to presidency/politics: Entirely tied to his time in office and political actions.
  
• Counter point: Acquittals mean the Senate (with a bipartisan mix in the second trial) didn't find the charges met the threshold for removal. This isn't equivalent to a "real trial with evidence, testimony, judge, jury" in the judicial sense—it's legislative, and outcomes often split along party lines.
  

2. The Mueller Report

• This was a 2019 special counsel investigation into Russian election interference in 2016, potential coordination with the Trump campaign, and obstruction of justice. It produced a 448-page report with extensive evidence, interviews, and analysis.
  
• Key findings: No evidence of criminal conspiracy or coordination between the Trump campaign and Russia (Volume I). On obstruction (Volume II), it outlined 10 potential instances but didn't recommend charges, citing DOJ policy against indicting a sitting president.
  
• Outcomes: No charges against Trump from Mueller. Related convictions were for campaign aides (e.g., Manafort, Flynn) on unrelated charges.
  
• Relevance to presidency/politics: Directly tied to his 2016 campaign and presidency.
  
• Counter point: The report explicitly cleared Trump on the core allegation (collusion/coordination). While it raised obstruction questions, AG William Barr (appointed by Trump) reviewed it and declined to pursue charges. It's not a "conviction" or even an indictment—it's an investigative summary, and critics on both sides have cherry-picked it.
  

3. "His Convictions for Fraud"

• This likely refers to the 2023-2024 New York civil fraud case brought by AG Letitia James against Trump and his business entities for inflating asset values to secure loans/insurance.
  
• Nature: Civil lawsuit, not criminal. No jail time possible; focused on financial penalties and business restrictions. Involved a bench trial (judge, no jury) with evidence and testimony.
  
• Outcome: In February 2024, Judge Arthur Engoron found Trump liable for fraud, ordering ~$355 million in penalties (plus interest, ballooning to ~$500 million). Trump was barred from running NY businesses for 3 years.
  
• Current status (2025): On appeal, the penalty was overturned by a New York appeals court in August 2025, though the fraud finding remains in place. Trump continues appealing.
  
• Relevance to presidency/politics: Pre-dates presidency; business dealings from 2010s.
  
• Counter point: This is a civil liability, not a criminal "conviction." No criminal charges were filed against Trump personally (though related criminal probes were dropped). The penalty reversal shows judicial review can alter outcomes, and Trump has argued it was politically motivated by a Democratic AG.
  

4. "His Conviction for Rape"

• This refers to the 2023 E. Jean Carroll civil defamation/sexual assault case.
  
• Nature: Civil trial (jury, evidence, testimony). Carroll alleged a 1990s assault; Trump countersued for defamation over her public claims.
  
• Outcome: Jury found Trump liable for sexual abuse (not rape under NY's narrow legal definition at the time) and defamation, awarding Carroll $5 million. A second 2024 defamation trial added $83.3 million.
  
• Current status (2025): Trump is appealing both verdicts to the U.S. Supreme Court (petition filed November 2025), arguing First Amendment protections and evidentiary issues.
  
• Relevance to presidency/politics: Pre-dates presidency; personal allegation.
  
• Counter point: Again, civil liability—not a criminal conviction or rape finding (the judge later noted the jury's verdict aligned with "rape" in common parlance, but legally it was abuse). No criminal charges were brought, and appeals are ongoing. Trump denies the claims and has won related defamation suits against media outlets.
  

5. "The Convictions of the Trump Organization"

• This refers to the 2022 criminal tax fraud trial of Trump Corp. and Trump Payroll Corp. (entities of the Trump Organization).
  
• Nature: Criminal trial (jury, evidence, testimony). Prosecutors alleged executives (including CFO Allen Weisselberg) evaded taxes on perks like apartments/cars.
  
• Outcome: In December 2022, the companies were convicted on 17 felony counts; fined $1.6 million. Weisselberg pleaded guilty separately.
  
• Current status (2025): Fines paid; no further actions. Trump was the sole director but not personally charged or tried.
  
• Relevance to presidency/politics: Business practices from 2000s-2010s; unrelated to office.
  
• Counter point: The companies were convicted, not Trump individually (he wasn't a defendant). As executive, he faced scrutiny but no personal liability here. Prosecutors focused on underlings, and Trump has called it a "witch hunt" targeting his brand.
  

Broader Context on "Real Trials" and Non-Political Ties

• "Real trials with evidence, etc.": Fair on the judicial ones (civil/criminal cases)—they had all that. But impeachments and Mueller aren't "trials" in that sense. Only one actual criminal conviction against Trump personally: the 2024 New York hush-money case (34 felony counts for falsifying business records tied to 2016 election). Even there, sentencing in January 2025 resulted in an "unconditional discharge"—he's a convicted felon on paper, but no jail, fine, or probation due to his status and appeals.
  
• Non-presidency ties: True for the business fraud, Carroll, and Trump Org cases—they stem from pre-2016 actions. But the hush-money case (if that's the "fraud" you meant) was explicitly about 2016 election influence.
  
• Overarching counter: Of these, only one led to a criminal conviction (hush money, with zero penalty). The rest are civil liabilities (appealable, no jail) or political processes (acquitted/cleared). Post-2024 election, federal cases (e.g., Jan. 6, classified docs) were dismissed. Many involved Democratic-led probes, raising questions of selective prosecution—e.g., no similar scrutiny for other politicians' business dealings. If the bar is "good enough" for what (disqualification? judgment?), facts show mixed results, not a slam-dunk pattern of guilt.
  

[Truthhurts]

What is going on with the Reich Wing and pedophiles? This marks the fifth incident in just two weeks.

[quintessentone]

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What is going on with the Reich Wing and pedophiles? This marks the fifth incident in just two weeks.

It looks like survivors of sexual abuse/trafficking are getting the courage to come forward thanks to other brave survivors who want justice.

---------

"Morris, 64, pleaded guilty last month to five counts of lewd or indecent acts to a child in Oklahoma. He received a 10-year suspended sentence, which included a six-month jail sentence, lifetime registration as a sex offender and $270,000 restitution paid to Clemishire. He is currently serving his sentence at the Osage County jail."

Gateway Church files appeal, asks again for Morris accuser’s defamation suit to be tossed

These peds think they are untouchable.