The Lesson At The Waterfall

[IdeomotorPrisoner]

A student asked, "Master, why can't I protect inner flame from being extinguished by the wind of time?"

The Master led him to a waterfall and told him to catch a single drop of the falling river. The student grasped at the spray, but try as he might he could only make his palm wet.

"I cannot grab a single drop," the student sighed. "There are too many and they are always moving."

The Master replied, "You are the moving water; you can only touch the river where it is, for the drop you seek is already gone, and the one you fear has yet to fall."

At that moment, the student was enlightened... and also wet from the waterfall he just tried to catch.

[WallFlowerActive]

Meanwhile, the lower classes were trying to scratch out a living from the ground.  And not allowed near the forbidden water fall.

[quintessentone]

EnlightenmentBy Lam Quang My

The man who tore a slice of heaven

Heard a silent sky

And thought again

And dropped his hand…

[Maxmars]

Reaching enlightenment is like what?

Is it like realizing some fact, or perspective?
Is it a kind of awakening to some harmony you only then hear?
What do we "see" now, that we hadn't before?
Or is it a "how" question... how do we see differently...

Those waters run deep.

[midicon]

Reaching enlightenment is like what?

Is it like realizing some fact, or perspective?
Is it a kind of awakening to some harmony you only then hear?
What do we "see" now, that we hadn't before?
Or is it a "how" question... how do we see differently...

Those waters run deep.

It is like nothing that can be said...so they say.

It is the dissolution of self. There is no 'self' present to, hear, see or ask how'.

Perhaps questions fall away like ghosts.

Perhaps too, that is why we only remember entering and returning.

[quintessentone]

[Image: https://denyignorance.com/uploader/image...296780.jpg]

A student asked, "Master, why can't I protect inner flame from being extinguished by the wind of time?"

The Master led him to a waterfall and told him to catch a single drop of the falling river. The student grasped at the spray, but try as he might he could only make his palm wet.

"I cannot grab a single drop," the student sighed. "There are too many and they are always moving."

The Master replied, "You are the moving water; you can only touch the river where it is, for the drop you seek is already gone, and the one you fear has yet to fall."

At that moment, the student was enlightened... and also wet from the waterfall he just tried to catch.

Isn't that teaching the same as this? ...

"Thich Nhat Hanh notes, "Nothing is more precious than being in the present moment.  Fully alive, fully aware," and adds that "The present moment is the only moment in which you can find everything you've been looking for.""

This one is a little off centre, but applicable to some here, including me. lol

"Every oak tree started out as a couple of nuts who stood their ground.
Henry David Thoreau"

[IdeomotorPrisoner]

Well I wanted to toss this koan into "Transgender Dukkha Attachment Thread #843" to screw with everyone.

I was going say "here is a koan about fluidity and what is real," or "why are the people who believe in afterlife, souls, and other shit they cant prove, enough to even "feel" it sometimes,  giving shit to the people that cross-identify? Talk about willfull delusions andd mental conditioning." 

But that would be too "adversarial" and too much fallacy, even for me, so  I went another direction there, and am now using "passive-aggression" here, I guess. 

But then I was left with a quasi-buddhist story about "anatman" and "anicca" and liked it too much to shelve it..

[Maxmars]

Could it be that we are (opposite of the aforementioned sense) trapped in the now? In all moments of realization... at that moment... As we see and learn the moment becomes frozen in the past, as an observation of a reality streaming before your mind... looking at any one thing for answers is "missing the trees for the forest"... or some such...

If we could actually perceive a total moment of reality... perhaps we couldn't possible come away with more than a 'perception' of what we experienced...

Sorry to muddle this...

But great thread!

[quintessentone]

Yes, what marvels would reveal themselves if we dare to live freely in one moment of time.

"A prominent koan addressing perception is "Two monks are arguing about a flag.  One says, 'The flag is moving.' The other, 'The wind is moving.' A third walks by and says, 'Not the wind, not the flag; the mind is moving.'" This dialogue illustrates that perception is not an objective observation of external objects but a projection of the mind's own activity. 

Another key example is "Look at the flower and the flower also looks," which challenges the dualistic separation between the observer and the observed to reveal a nondual reality.  These koans are not riddles to be solved logically but are tools designed to interrupt habitual thought patterns and force the practitioner to drop attachments to images and beliefs. 

By focusing on such paradoxes, Zen practice aims to help students recognize that reality is perceived through the lens of the mind, leading to a direct experience of kenshō (seeing one's true nature) where the distinction between subject and object dissolves. "

https://choosemuse.com/blogs/news/zen-ko...nd-paradox

"Originating in Zen Buddhism, they help practitioners sit with ambiguity, let go of binary thinking, and explore self-discovery beyond conventional thought."

[midicon]

Yes, what marvels would reveal themselves if we dare to live freely in one moment of time.

"A prominent koan addressing perception is "Two monks are arguing about a flag.  One says, 'The flag is moving.' The other, 'The wind is moving.' A third walks by and says, 'Not the wind, not the flag; the mind is moving.'" This dialogue illustrates that perception is not an objective observation of external objects but a projection of the mind's own activity. 

Another key example is "Look at the flower and the flower also looks," which challenges the dualistic separation between the observer and the observed to reveal a nondual reality.  These koans are not riddles to be solved logically but are tools designed to interrupt habitual thought patterns and force the practitioner to drop attachments to images and beliefs. 

By focusing on such paradoxes, Zen practice aims to help students recognize that reality is perceived through the lens of the mind, leading to a direct experience of kenshō (seeing one's true nature) where the distinction between subject and object dissolves. "

https://choosemuse.com/blogs/news/zen-ko...nd-paradox

"Originating in Zen Buddhism, they help practitioners sit with ambiguity, let go of binary thinking, and explore self-discovery beyond conventional thought."

So where are you with all of that? What good does it, or will it do you?

What is the point of reading that material and posting about it?

I am truly curious and coming from a different perspective, different from you or those monks.