Net Zero advocates propose ticks to induce red meat allergy as climate solution

[quintessentone]

We are at the end of a long ancestry chain in shaping this world. Not everything goes to plan, some growing pains at times. Keep doing the best we can got us this far.

Did we do the best we can? That is debatable.

[DBCowboy]

If you don't want to eat meat, then don't eat meat.

It's that simple.

But to dictate to others what they can and cannot eat is tyranny, authoritarian.

[MichSwampbuck]

Some people will never find their way outside of the box, even after you open it for them to escape. I have no problem with acknowledging the status quo, but I was never a trendy.

I suppose I must post about what ethics and morals can be applied here, but with moral relativity and other postmodern pitfalls, it seems so useless when there is no objective reality involved.

The main concern here seems to be that certain human activities are creating an overpopulation and overcrowding situation of animals that has no redeeming value and is damaging to the environment. It is also being thought that such an imbalance is unnatural or in opposition to nature's normal balancing act. Be all this as it may be, none of that addresses the morality of the proposed idea. You can prove beyond a doubt that these are valid concerns, but that could never justify what has been proposed.

Just change the laws like they did here like requiring laying hens to be free range only and outlaw the industrial farming practices. That is the moral way to handle this, that is really my point with posting this thread.

[Kwaka]

Maybe how we raise cattle is a survival dead end at some point down the line. 

Depends on the farmer. Lot of room here for cattle to move around, they tend to mind themselves for the most part. Not always easy in a land of drought and flooding rains.

As for how some of these farms have gone trying to maximize profit with limited space, pushing boundaries.  Nature does find a balance one way or another.

Crazy to see what the EU has done to a lot of their farmers. Humans have been working with cow longer than working with money. As for where it ends, in the restaurant at the end of the universe the cows are grateful.

[MichSwampbuck]

Depends on the farmer. Lot of room here for cattle to move around, they tend to mind themselves for the most part. Not always easy in a land of drought and flooding rains.

As for how some of these farms have gone trying to maximize profit with limited space, pushing boundaries.  Nature does find a balance one way or another.

Crazy to see what the EU has done to a lot of their farmers. Humans have been working with cow longer than working with money. As for where it ends, in the restaurant at the end of the universe the cows are grateful.

You have brought up a point that illustrates what I was saying about humans being natural, "Humans have been working with cow longer than working with money."

Why do the lock-step, indoctrinated, academic liberals ignore this fact but embrace the symbiotic relationships of "natural" wildlife? What makes us any different and unnatural?

If there is any moral lesson in all of this, it is that greed is "evil". However, even that characteristic was a survival trait created by nature's laws.

[SomeStupidName]

Did we do the best we can? That is debatable.

You'll never get perfection here. We will always be able to do better and the fact that we continue to choose to improve ourselves in a direction that has allowed for the most amount of growth throughout all of our recorded history is the best we can muster at this time.

We can always do better and do more and we always will.

[MichSwampbuck]

I have been wanting to expand my vocabulary and this one word offers an answer to my previous question,

"Why do the lock-step, indoctrinated, academic liberals ignore this fact (human and animal symbiosis) but embrace the symbiotic relationships of "natural" wildlife? What makes us any different and unnatural?"

That magic word is "hubris" and has its origin in the Greek language. The following is the basic meaning of this word from the Merriam-Webster Dictionary.
 

exaggerated pride or self-confidence

Simple and complete, but the details offered by the dictionary are important.
 

Hubris Comes From Ancient Greece
English picked up both the concept of hubris and the term for that particular brand of cockiness from the ancient Greeks, who considered hubris a dangerous character flaw capable of provoking the wrath of the gods. In classical Greek tragedy, hubris was often a fatal shortcoming that brought about the fall of the tragic hero.

Proverbs 16:18 KJV
"Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall."
 

haughty : blatantly and disdainfully proud : having or showing an attitude of superiority and contempt for people or things perceived to be inferior

[quintessentone]

You'll never get perfection here. We will always be able to do better and the fact that we continue to choose to improve ourselves in a direction that has allowed for the most amount of growth throughout all of our recorded history is the best we can muster at this time.

We can always do better and do more and we always will.

While these two bioethicists have free speech, I don't agree with their approach.

We can do better by spreading the truth about eating red meat as well as the overcrowding of farm animals which causes them harm and disease.

The simple spreading of the truth to people by empirical scientific evidence that eating beef offers no health benefit should get the message across.

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"As a cardiologist and professor of nutrition, I’d like to clear up some of the confusion with five myths and five facts about meat."

"Myth: Red meat is good for healthLong-term observational studies of heart disease, cancers or death, and controlled trials of risk factors like blood cholesterol, glucose, and inflammation suggest that modest intake of unprocessed red meat is relatively neutral for health. But no major studies suggest that eating it provides benefits.
 
So, while an occasional serving of steak, lamb, or pork may not worsen your health, it also won’t improve it. And, too much heme iron, which gives red meat its color, may explain why red meat increases the risk of type 2 diabetes. Eating red meat often, and eating processed meat even occasionally, is also strongly linked to colorectal cancer."

"Myth: Grass-fed beef is better for your healthConventional livestock eats a combination of forage (grass, other greens, legumes) plus hay with added corn, soy, barley, or grain. “Grass-fed,” or “pasture-raised,” livestock eat primarily, but not exclusively, forage. “Grass-finished” livestock should, in theory, only eat forage. But no agency regulates the industry’s use of these terms. And “free-range” describes where an animal lives, not what it eats.
 
“Grass-fed” may sound better, but no studies have compared the health effects of eating grass-fed versus conventional beef. Nutrient analyses show very modest differences between grass-fed and conventionally raised livestock. You might eat grass-fed beef for personal, environmental, or philosophical reasons. But don’t expect health benefits."

Scientists debunk 5 common meat-eating myths

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[MichSwampbuck]

I must repeat myself about the actual subject to address that last post.
 

none of that addresses the morality of the proposed idea. You can prove beyond a doubt that these are valid concerns, but that could never justify what has been proposed.

You have to agree then, based on your statement "I don't agree with their approach", that this isn't about the ethical treatment of animals but instead that this is about the ethical treatment of humans.

[SomeStupidName]

While these two bioethicists have free speech, I don't agree with their approach.

We can do better by spreading the truth about eating red meat as well as the overcrowding of farm animals which causes them harm and disease.

The simple spreading of the truth to people by empirical scientific evidence that eating beef offers no health benefit should get the message across.

-------------

"As a cardiologist and professor of nutrition, I’d like to clear up some of the confusion with five myths and five facts about meat."

"Myth: Red meat is good for healthLong-term observational studies of heart disease, cancers or death, and controlled trials of risk factors like blood cholesterol, glucose, and inflammation suggest that modest intake of unprocessed red meat is relatively neutral for health. But no major studies suggest that eating it provides benefits.
 
So, while an occasional serving of steak, lamb, or pork may not worsen your health, it also won’t improve it. And, too much heme iron, which gives red meat its color, may explain why red meat increases the risk of type 2 diabetes. Eating red meat often, and eating processed meat even occasionally, is also strongly linked to colorectal cancer."

"Myth: Grass-fed beef is better for your healthConventional livestock eats a combination of forage (grass, other greens, legumes) plus hay with added corn, soy, barley, or grain. “Grass-fed,” or “pasture-raised,” livestock eat primarily, but not exclusively, forage. “Grass-finished” livestock should, in theory, only eat forage. But no agency regulates the industry’s use of these terms. And “free-range” describes where an animal lives, not what it eats.
 
“Grass-fed” may sound better, but no studies have compared the health effects of eating grass-fed versus conventional beef. Nutrient analyses show very modest differences between grass-fed and conventionally raised livestock. You might eat grass-fed beef for personal, environmental, or philosophical reasons. But don’t expect health benefits."

Scientists debunk 5 common meat-eating myths

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I think it's great to spread information and allow people to make their own decisions on their diet. No I don't mean you can decide to have a side of tide pods with that. I like Oreo ice-cream I know it has no nutritional value and is not to required for me to exist and that it's production has a negative impact on the environment. I don't care, it taste good and makes me happy. So does steak... and whiskey.