Maxmars - When you realize what "marketing" has become

[Maxmars]

No... this is not a mistake.


It is an idea...

It's in the members section because this section is for us...
and what I offer for you to consider.

It is not me trying to say 
The world's on fire
Mankind sucks
People are stupid

But it's my own personal foray into experiencing, objectively: "MARKETING"

Not what they SAY it is.
Not WHY they do it.

Just WHAT the "masters" of this craft manifest as a "service"...

(unfortunately, even the government wallows in the pit of "make them think" land...
and with the entrenched corporate presence there, the net effect is...
they are practically useless as a measure of control over this stuff.)

I will try not to kvetch... only describe.

Here are some 'product' examples you can see...The Most Evil Packaging Designs That Were Created To Deceive People
(This is not my work... kudos to the author(s) at Happy Land, who offer it as lighthearted entertainment.)

Mind you, this isn't just about "product labeling" but misrepresentation of service...

It may flux and shift, but ultimately this thread is about what we actually 'receive'
in return for our faith in their work, their words.

Well... a couple of "last" things...

This is not me whining about how greed and the market have usurped reason...
This is about knowing we're being lied to 'by default'... and somehow not registering
the damage they are doing across the generations by normalizing dishonesty...

I consider this thread a personal effort.  It will take time, but I would appreciate any and all interested to join in, if you'd like.
I think you might find it easier to take your cues from the video about the aspect of marketing that I'm trying to surround and define.
I won't b blaming institutions, or the tendencies of corporations and clusters of people, in fact, I won't be kvetching about "people" in general.
I intend to focus on "the general effect of marketers actually do in our world. - as an "influence."

Please refrain from reservation...

[UltraBudgie]

America has become a "zero-sum game", where there is always a "winner" and a "loser" in every commercial transaction.

It seems the purpose of marketing has been to replace "trust" and "integrity" with the perception of trust and integrity. In fact those concepts are now considered "quaint", only perhaps seen locally. The larger environment is predatory and deceptive. You are right to point out "the damage they are doing across the generations by normalizing dishonesty". I feel that ship has sailed and nothing that can be done to "correct" the problem can be trusted, it will always be merely a new deceptive way to attempt to recapture the perception of integrity.

The best approximation to "trust" any more is the expectation that of course they're trying to screw us. That's just how it work, and to a large extent we don't even really care any more. Perhaps it has ever been thus. Caveat emptor. But never this bad?

Is it late-stage capitalism? Generations raised in propaganda?

They know exactly how much they can lower quality and increase prices before people change their buying habits, or demand a refund. Almost no one does. It's sad. The erosion of trust in society is an external cost, like the rainforests, so it doesn't factor in to the financial calculations that are being made.

It's quality, too. Trifecta. Lower quality, lower quantity, higher prices. The triple-breaking point that never seems to break, because what's the alternative? Lines are still around the building for Chick-Fil-A.

Maybe there's an upside. There was a Star Trek episode where the Enterprise had a giant "space baby" alien attached to it, leeching off the power source, nursing on the warp core. They chased it away without killing it by "souring the milk" -- changing the energy until it was no longer palatable. Maybe that's what capitalism is doing, souring the milk of commercial dependence until we are fed up, and become more self-sufficient. Or it kills us.

Learn to cook. Grow food. Make your own products.

Example: Windex now sucks. It's the worst glass cleaner. It used to be pretty good, but people still buy it because they had a good advertisting campaign in the 80s and it is burned into their brain. Bottles are now smaller and the price is ridiculous. Make your own glass cleaner: 1/4 cup white vinegar, 1/2 tsp dish soap, 2 cups water. Easy. Works great.

[Maxmars]

Sorry for the encasing in a quote... but I will fix this somehow.

America has become a "zero-sum game", where there is always a "winner" and a "loser" in every commercial transaction.

I think it can be largely attributed to culture, this "winner" "loser" perspective, contextually speaking.

In a finite transaction, there will always be a balance point (however derived) met...
only the corporate paradigm has demonstrated their unwillingness to accept balance... ever.

So in the pie chart 'slicing' up "that which is to be had" their "slice" is concrete, eternal, unimpeachable thus unmolested
Our slice, seems different, ethereal at times, so tragically impacted by seemingly any single thing -
(especially when illuminated by a media narrative of 'crisis.' - the ultimate marketing.)

It seems the purpose of marketing has been to replace "trust" and "integrity" with the perception of trust and integrity. In fact those concepts are now considered "quaint", only perhaps seen locally. The larger environment is predatory and deceptive. You are right to point out "the damage they are doing across the generations by normalizing dishonesty". I feel that ship has sailed and nothing that can be done to "correct" the problem can be trusted, it will always be merely a new deceptive way to attempt to recapture the perception of integrity.

I differ in that regardless I think we are beyond the point of only "suspecting" this, and the "purpose" might even be a center of distraction
to understand what it is - that is dishonest that is being foisted upon literally everyone...

but as I'm sure you find tiresome by now... this had been their time
the time of "rule" by appearance...
It's a thing I commented on before (ad nauseum)...
the thespian outlook and influence in the political society.

The best approximation to "trust" any more is the expectation that of course they're trying to screw us. That's just how it work, and to a large extent we don't even really care any more. Perhaps it has ever been thus. Caveat emptor. But never this bad?

Is it late-stage capitalism? Generations raised in propaganda?

Our problem? I would suggest that it is the propaganda.

It's the insistent compulsion to "tell" people what to think, and the self-entitlement to do so.
(and the drive to make that easier and easier for a smaller and smaller 
subsets of society.)

But that's just me.

... the problem is we* "can't" really escape mechanism they control...
It's in the woodwork.

* - that's the 'proverbial' we... I expect no reaction to these words. Anti-activist here.

They know exactly how much they can lower quality and increase prices before people change their buying habits, or demand a refund. Almost no one does. It's sad. The erosion of trust in society is an external cost, like the rainforests, so it doesn't factor in to the financial calculations that are being made.

It's quality, too. Trifecta. Lower quality, lower quantity, higher prices. The triple-breaking point that never seems to break, because what's the alternative? Lines are still around the building for Chick-Fil-A.

I would have lumped all that up with sheer greed.
Planned obsolescence, not ONLY replacement part, but also service hostage-hood.
Then there's the 'support' racket... mostly the stuff of 3rd party "dis-"associates...
it's all pretty "in your face."

Maybe there's an upside. There was a Star Trek episode where the Enterprise had a giant "space baby" alien attached to it, leeching off the power source, nursing on the warp core. They chased it away without killing it by "souring the milk" -- changing the energy until it was no longer palatable. Maybe that's what capitalism is doing, souring the milk of commercial dependence until we are fed up, and become more self-sufficient. Or it kills us.

Learn to cook. Grow food. Make your own products.

Example: Windex now sucks. It's the worst glass cleaner. It used to be pretty good, but people still buy it because they had a good advertisting campaign in the 80s and it is burned into their brain. Bottles are now smaller and the price is ridiculous. Make your own glass cleaner: 1/4 cup white vinegar, 1/2 tsp dish soap, 2 cups water. Easy. Works great.

As a junk food addict I've watched in horror as all the best stuff was "changed for the better"...
(the caution notes are usually about something someone somewhere sued for... yeah... that.)

So now though smaller, we pay more, but the packaging is much prettier,
(don't worry, we're paying for that too.)

[covent]

Marketing, yuk, truly despicable practice. See lots of reference to propaganda and now they are basically the same. Why I find marketing so distasteful  is how it uses coercive techniques to control people's behaviour and how this often results in people putting aside their personal values and being coerced into guilt if they don't. 

It is not just about buying stuff, also about what to think about issues, how to vote and even what to feel. 

Totally unconscionable and without any integrity at all.

[Nerb]

Here are some 'product' examples you can see...The Most Evil Packaging Designs That Were Created To Deceive People

It's these kind of things that helped me leave the Design, Packaging and Adveretising business many years ago.

"Whiter Than White".
"New Formula".
"Best Ever".
"Premium Product".
"New Recipe".
"Eco Friendly".
"20% FREE".
"Reduced Price".
"New Price".
"Bollocks".
"Bollocks".
"Bollocks".

It's all just "stuff" in absolutely rediculously over-designed fancy packaging to fool the eyes and confuse the mind.

That and the fact that the ingredients and information for things got so expanded and convoluted but the space for them stayed the same to prioritise the fancy visuals, so even I who was doing the typography couldn't read the miniscule typefaces or keep up with all the badges, certificates, codes and all the blah blah blah. "Small Print" is deliberately engineered. By the time new packaging hit the shelvess we were working on the next one.

I was also an artist in studios, and there was little genuine creativity in the industry any more, other than HOW TO DECEIVE money out of people's pockets with blatant endless bullshite and a big dose of plageurism. All the art noobs coming into the industry were computer nerds too who couldn't even draw. They had no creative talents of their own, just the ability to use a computer and copy and paste. Worthless badges from a college or university so they (and their parents) could talk endlessly about them.

The prices for some goods has become stupid because of all the rescources needed just to gain a tiny boost to the market share and all the huge costs of keeping up with replacing over-familiar visuals.

Keep It Simple Stupid.

I rarely buy brand names now because I know what is being paid for. An inferior product wrapped in expensive lies.

[eriathwen]

It's these kind of things that helped me leave the Design, Packaging and Adveretising business many years ago.

"Whiter Than White".
"New Formula".
"Best Ever".
"Premium Product".
"New Recipe".
"Eco Friendly".
"20% FREE".
"Reduced Price".
"New Price".
"Bollocks".
"Bollocks".
"Bollocks".

It's all just "stuff" in absolutely rediculously over-designed fancy packaging to fool the eyes and confuse the mind.

That and the fact that the ingredients and information for things got so expanded and convoluted but the space for them stayed the same to prioritise the fancy visuals, so even I who was doing the typography couldn't read the miniscule typefaces or keep up with all the badges, certificates, codes and all the blah blah blah. "Small Print" is deliberately engineered. By the time new packaging hit the shelvess we were working on the next one.

I was also an artist in studios, and there was little genuine creativity in the industry any more, other than HOW TO DECEIVE money out of people's pockets with blatant endless bullshite and a big dose of plageurism. All the art noobs coming into the industry were computer nerds too who couldn't even draw. They had no creative talents of their own, just the ability to use a computer and copy and paste. Worthless badges from a college or university so they (and their parents) could talk endlessly about them.

The prices for some goods has become stupid because of all the rescources needed just to gain a tiny boost to the market share and all the huge costs of keeping up with replacing over-familiar visuals.

Keep It Simple Stupid.

I rarely buy brand names now because I know what is being paid for. An inferior product wrapped in expensive lies.

Yes I agree, cheers to keeping It simple :) Nature, home, family and friends :)

[quintessentone]

My purchasing power lies within other purchaser's reviews/use of a product only and we are so lucky these days to have that type of valuable data to help us get to the truth. Could some of the reviews be planted? Sure, but it's easy to pick out those out of the legit ones and so far, this has worked for me in selecting high quality, low cost products.

[UltraBudgie]

This is not me whining about how greed and the market have usurped reason...
This is about knowing we're being lied to 'by default'... and somehow not registering
the damage they are doing across the generations by normalizing dishonesty...

Makes me think about "across generations", and the generation "gap".

What is this gap made of? A difference in common society worldly experience, and differences in perception of "how to live life", and putting things in "context". Which we have let advertisers (politicians and news "media" included) do for us for the last 100 years, at a rate ever-increasing.

Maybe 500 hundred years ago, life when you're 80 was different from life when you were 20, but it wasn't that much different. Today, it's worlds apart. Several times in our lives, we realize that the world we knew was gone, and the "younger generation" never knew it. That creates gaps.

And advertisers love this! It lets them "split demographics", and target with more precision. In fact they encourage the divisions and constantly update their pitches in a cascade. If 3/4 of your market is under 30, none of them is going to remember the quality and standards of your product from the early 2000s, so proceed with enshittification!

The knock-on harm this does to society is immeasurable. We have "Boomers", "GenX", "Millennials", "GenZ"... and often the "slice" of the 'targeted demographics" can't even talk to another on the same level, because they've been pitched such different world views by their "advertisers". Employment stratifies. Voter majority becomes impossible unless manipulated complexly. Societal cohesion becomes "owned".

I'm thinking of the writers of the American Revolution, and how they ranged from 20-80 years old, and addressed each other just fine across that "gap". Could we do that today? Who does that lack of cohesion serve?