Eugenics

[Sirius]

With how intense the transgenderism has gone, looks like a state sanctioned IQ test for who gets sterilized.

How do you come to that conclusion? Why is it so hard to understand that people are shaped by their environment?

Easy to shift the blame to some higher ideology, hard to confront your brothers and sisters. Shhhhhh, we don't speak about that.

[Ray1990]

One last pushback... thanks for indulging me.



I expected that there was a series of arguments which support the notion that the direction and focus of eugenics should be to focus on culling...rather than actually actively living a better life.  What does this "philosophy" actually "affirm?"

However why is the shining moment of eugenic manifestation the dump truck full of the corpses of undesirable,  the limp dead bodies of children with ugly birthmarks... and of course the bodies of those who no one loved enough to save, because you know it will come to that. 

Eugenics will also be applied eventually by more enlightened 'eugenicists' who come to the mindset that left-handed people are genetically undesirables, or people that "our leaders" don't 'want' (think Jews, Uyghurs, 'poor people,' the unvaccinated, etc.)

The 'breeding improvement' by subtraction principle is grandly pragmatic, for a bushel of chicks, a heard of sheep, or someone concerned with product quality.
Where in Eugenics does it say that the human condition empowers murdering the guiltless for their afflictions, prohibiting human endeavors, value judging an unrealized future?

I think the focus of the study of the human condition would not be remedied by a death strategy... nor a process to 'segregate' "undesirables" (deplorables?) into a meat grinder.

The misuse of Eugenics as a "intellectual" shield to perform and orchestrate life-ending processes seems to deny the idea that life purpose is not to serve man...but to experience and witness human reality as we've made it.

"Jettison" the "lower quality"/high maintenance people helps only those who are not jettisoned. 
Eugenics says if someone don't measure up... they're outta here!"

Never mind that the tiny little baby brain is a potentially brilliant person, all that potential killed by hubris and presumption.

Yeah... no.

[Please accept my apologies if I accidentally made it seem personal, like I was judging or commenting on you... I really appreciate this chat!  ]

Everything can seem more than it is, I'm sure their was naive crusaders as much as Leninists on red square, common folk support all sorts of things that turn out to be very bad... Ever noticed that extremism attracts extremism? It's a human thing, sometimes the pendulum swings wildly. We don't do well with change unless we're the ones wielding it. Jesus would say "chill out knobhead" or "give onto" I'd reckon.

Conflict being the obvious answer.

These days I take a more spiritualist approach myself. There's not enough time in my life to even know what I'd do in every situation so I honestly cannot fathom how I can apply judgement to another life and it's possibilities. Finding others worthy of life is a hilarious question to me, no two people can truly agree on what worth is never mind the meaning of life or what makes a successful human.

I wasn't offended, I was attempting to be precise which seemingly always comes across a bit.... Aggressive?

Back to eugenics, the only thing I could even remotely consider plausible would be mass sterilisation via fully informed consent. That ain't happening when people still have kids despite a Dr telling them it will suffer and live a short life with constant intervention. It's why I'd then say maybe licenses? Which isn't practical or ethical either and would be rife for abuse across nations. There's another option that I suspect is being used today... Genetic manipulation, I have no answer to that because there's nothing I can do about militaries making cyborgs and supersoldiers, hopefully they'll all feck off to Mars after they've chimera'd the 'best' genetics.

[Ray1990]

Maybe they are and maybe I am mate - am all for clarification.

Am specifically referring to the Fabian 'anti-humanist' aspects put forth by the British /American adoption of the subject pre WW2; the silly and dangerous idea of 'dysgenic germ plasms'; useless eaters, human weeds; forced sterilisations, forced abortions, forced euthanasia; forced population control; banning the hippocratic oath, death panels, mass exterminator in 'humane' gas chambers (to classical music) etc.

Plenty of utterly outrageous, completely unhinged unscientific 'beliefs' found in the annals of the American Eugenics (and British Fabian) societies and probably no coincidence that the majority of the folks involved were also Malthusian cultists.

Maybe I am more leaning towards the 'church' rather than the 'religion' mate and I salute you for pointing it out - the way I've always seen it 'eugenics' is a truly poisonous ideology (and I do understand that folks have always understood good breeding) - the church rather than the religion actually does exist though and the behaviour of the practitioners has resulted in so much horrific evil due to the pseudoscientific belief in an imaginary 'lesser human' that is an extremely reviled one all around the globe (and I'd say rightfully so).

Cheers.

Honestly? I don't think they're doing a good job at what's proclaimed, I can understand it's dastardly and complex, maybe they're targeted certain groups that are actually a tiny majority and the rest is collateral, their nets becoming ever more ethical as time goes by.

I mean a lot of us are super vulnerable whether it's the drugs that prolong our lives or the foodstuffs we rely on. Just stopping logistics would kill most of us off. With a bit understanding of technology anyone can realise they're barely even trying considering that vast capability they have at their disposal.

Seems like utter morons larping, that said I've always enjoyed this quote:
"People of the same trade seldom meet together, even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the public, or in some contrivance to raise prices"

Yeah... Always up to something.

[Kwaka]

I argue that Eugenics is an ideology...
if you don't fit a eugenic standard, you're not human... allowing you to "live" is a "bad" thing.

Eugenics is a reality in the way things have been going. In some ways, jungle rules still apply. Now it is a battlefield of lawfare and corporate regulations. All I can control is my own back yard. We would not of made it this far if our ancestors did not stand their ground.

[Kwaka]

How do you come to that conclusion? Why is it so hard to understand that people are shaped by their environment?

I fully agree with that. Things like how BPA, the plastic used inside tin cans have a similar molecular structure to Estrogen. Alex Jones warned a lot time ago the frogs are turning gay. The hormone front is just one of many in full spectrum domination.

Not surprised some kids are getting confused. When hitting kids before they have gone through puberty and start to know what some of these hormones are about is next level. How places like California want to keep the transition process secret from the parents until it is too late... Is the Getty Museum really that bad?

A Conversation With GROK about OccupyTheGetty #3 - The Steven D Kelley Show - April 3, 2025

[quintessentone]

Looks like Bill Gates hit his excess mortality mark of 10%. Hard to say the exact number as the Australian Bureau of Statisticss cannot find a calculator like Barry Young in NZ could. The anonymized record level data is a state secret while many cannot go to work without that jab?

Eugenics ain't new. If you really think things are that bad, start with yourself, What the UN has become getting a bunch of megalomaniacs/psychopaths together has it issues. Having a building where nations can sort their stuff out without directly killing each other is an improvement.

China has been big on Eugenics for a while. Lot of hard stories around the one child policy. Now the Weigers and prison population in organ harvesting. If I was in the ruling class of such fertile land, listen to god/nature, do not consent to things that don't make sense., take it one day at a time. There is a significant cognitohazzard when thinking you can own it all. There is too much going on to think we can comprehend it all.

EDIT:  mod note to correct title spelling

If you want to get rid of a lot of locals, an interplanetary/stellar program will have a lot of losses. When it came to the colonization of Australia, many nations tried over the centuries and millennia. Egypt, china and Nordics done better than most a long time ago. The survivors got taken in by the locals. It was the British that where first in establishing a colony. From some reports, 95% of the first fleet died. Those with the guns held their ground until the next fleet arrived. London considered this a great success as at least something held. Many more boats arrived. The French did not make the colonization cut at the time, got close.

So do we kill and shorten life on many from some RNA experiment, or do we value informed consent where most that do try for space travel will fail. Maybe some will survive with enough resources and backup?

I see my area more like a country town. The first freeway is growing to make it a city. I know congestion  sucks Nature already has death sorted. Not on board a panic attack with that one.

Is there a good argument for humanity? Is there a good argument  for eugenic?

I know my day is coming, If there is life after death, I am putting in for another planet with how crazy things are here. Any comment, rant or insight is welcome.

There is not a good argument for eugenics as the whole theory was founded on flawed reasoning.
 

Despite its popularity, the eugenics movement was doomed from the start because most of the traits studied by eugenicists had little genetic basis. Among those characteristics targeted for elimination from the human population were such complex and subjectively defined traits as "criminality," epilepsy, bipolar disorder, alcoholism, and "feeblemindedness," a catchall term used to describe varying degrees of mental retardation and learning disabilities. The possibility that environmental factors (such as poor housing, poor nutrition, and inadequate education) might influence the development of these traits was dismissed.
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Despite the events of the past, there are still many individuals yet today who support eugenic arguments against the decision to knowingly give birth to a child with a genetic disorder, cognitive impairment, or physical disability. Society, however, must accept that one person's definition of "disabled" or "impaired" may be drastically different from another person's. Deafness, for example, is seen by some as a disability and by others as merely a different way of living. Consider the case of a deaf lesbian couple in the U.S. who, in 2002, revealed that they had specifically sought out a hearing-impaired sperm donor to conceive their two children, who were indeed born deaf (Spriggs, 2002). Now, consider those parents who are either affected by or carriers of a genetic disorder who turn to modern techniques such as preimplantation genetic diagnosis to select for embryos that will be born without the genetic condition in question. Stories such as these have refueled the ethical debate over "designer babies" and whether society has a right to choose what types of children are born.

https://www.nature.com/scitable/topicpag...-irbs-724/

I have hope for humanity through epigenics: "Epigenetics is the study of heritable changes in gene expression that occur without alterations to the DNA sequence itself. These changes, often involving modifications to DNA or associated proteins, can affect how genes are read and interpreted, leading to differences in cell behavior and function."

As for organ transplants, I just read of two recent successful transplants using a pig organ; specifically a  kidney. This will be the future of organ transplant as they progress with this science.

Is there any good argument for humanity, you ask? I think so, if we can elect the right type of leaders who abandon the old ways and adapt to handling societal, political and economic trends and changes for the good of everyone. If not, the same problems will always exist. Is that humanity's fault, is that the human condition, is that our leaders' faults?

Colonization, early and recent, have many factors to it, not just displacing or absorbing indigenous peoples for some superiority complex, although I might exclude religious missionary goals/expansion in that thought.

Nature will do what nature does, sustain us or kill us. If we help it along through poisoning our water and air, then we need our best and brightest to figure out remedial measures, or we succumb to our selfishness and destructiveness via sickness, poverty, etc.

As for longevity science, it's simply amazing what they are discovering, including holding off dementia using antidiabetic drugs, as one example, and age-related diseases/issues using nanobots for precision healing, and AI to catch health decline faster. Life expectancy will continue to rise into the future.

The jab may soon be replaced by nanobot RNA tinkering, perhaps CRISPR?

Humanity deserves praise in some areas, not so much in others IMO.

[Sirius]

I fully agree with that. Things like how BPA, the plastic used inside tin cans have a similar molecular structure to Estrogen. Alex Jones warned a lot time ago the frogs are turning gay. The hormone front is just one of many in full spectrum domination.

Not surprised some kids are getting confused. When hitting kids before they have gone through puberty and start to know what some of these hormones are about is next level. How places like California want to keep the transition process secret from the parents until it is too late... Is the Getty Museum really that bad?

A Conversation With GROK about OccupyTheGetty #3 - The Steven D Kelley Show - April 3, 2025

Here is my conundrum. What you say is polarising and the these lines have been used for anti American sentiments in coordinated attacks on social media for years.

[Kwaka]

 What you say is polarising

Sexual reproduction is. Just the way it works. One goes in, the other sticks out. If you prefer some clone type asexual reproduction?

[Sirius]

Sexual reproduction is. Just the way it works. One goes in, the other sticks out. If you prefer some clone type asexual reproduction?

Funny you should ask about that, I just happened to have made a thread about it. https://denyignorance.com/Thread-Venus

Please ignore what I said, some things just clicked together.