Debunking Native American Fairy Tales

[andy06shake]

Where in Europe was widespread cannibalism practiced?

Anywhere, there was the likes of extreme famines.

Or sieges that have lasted longer than a city's food supply...

It's not that hard to establish that it has happened in the past. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannibalism_in_Europe

During the First Crusade, some crusaders ate the bodies of killed enemies, with the reasons for these acts (hunger or intimidation) being a matter of debate. Various cases of undoubtedly revenge-driven cannibalism took place in early modern Italy. In 1672, the Dutch statesman Johan de Witt and his brother were lynched and partially eaten by an angry mob. In early modern Europe, the consumption of body parts and blood for medical purposes became popular. Reaching its height during the 17th century, this practice continued in some cases into the second half of the 19th century.[sup][6][/sup]
The first half of the 20th century saw a resurgence of acts of survival cannibalism in Eastern Europe, especially during the Russian famine of 1921–1922, the Soviet famine of 1930–1933, and the siege of Leningrad. Several serial killers, among them Karl Denke and Andrei Chikatilo, consumed parts of their victims. A few other people, such as reporter William Seabrook and artist Rick Gibson, ate human flesh out of curiosity or to shock the public, without killing anyone for the purpose. At the start of the 21st century, Armin Meiwes became infamous for killing and eating a voluntary victim, whom he had found via the Internet.

[ChiefD]

I think Matt Walsh is another right wing fundamentalist "christian" nutbag. I wouldn't believe anything this guy says. There are all kinds of people like him all over right wing social media and TV. They will say anything that will get them views and lots of $$$.

[Byrd]

The natives of the Americas may have been violent and treated one another terribly and that is a shame, but I think Matt Walsh's analysis misses the bigger issue.  What if, instead of the USA and other orderly nations, the Americas had become an untaxable wasteland of escaped criminals and then fallen to the Ottomans or the Ming?  

"untaxable wasteland of escaped criminals"?

You mean...  Native American tribes who already lived there?  Big cities like Cahokia with its farms and roads?

The Ottomans did not stop taking European slaves until their dissolution in the 20th century. 

Some sources claim Columbus' African pilot seemed to have an idea of where he was going.

It is possible the Barbary Pirates or some other group had discovered the new world before Europe and had started to traffic slaves to them. 

There is the Loxahatchee river in Florida, which sounds like a corruption for the informal Arabic words for "the furthest pilgrimage," or al-aqsa hajj.

The Ottomans took EVERYONE slaves.  Not just Europeans.

The Barbary Pirates weren't sailing cross ocean in the 1400's.  And the Vikings discovered America long before that.

There was no one in America to sell slaves to before 1490.  Selling slaves to the Native Americans would be a waste of time; they had few slaves and didn't have any coinage with which to buy slaves even if they'd wanted them.

Loxahatches does NOT sound anything like the Arabic phrase.  It's a local name and means "River of Turtles" in Seminole (a language that's still spoken today)


Just because a word "sort of" looks like another word doesn't mean that's how it's sounded or that the second language borrowed it from the first.

[govshill2]

[Long Loud Whistle]

Who knew the U.S. Government had NGOs handling The Trail of Tears project with big money lump-paid!!

Sounds too familiar don't it    

Who was the first Democrat President?

OhOh!      

[Byrd]

In detail, the chiefs were fully funded to safely transport te tribes, but the contracts went to admins, like the brother, who stole the loot. Sounds a lot like the modern liberal playbook. Notwithstanding the "trolling" is comparative analysis of THEIR OWN ACTIONS.

There were multiple removals, and people didn't want to leave their homes.  (Also, the "bounty" works out to a little less than $1.00 per person.)  Several groups had to be rescued -- one entire group was lost when the "guide" led them into the swamps and everyone died.

Walsh glosses over all of that, making it sound like it was just a vacation and not that they were selling already owned land where generations had lived and farmed and worked -- declaring eminent domain and taking grandparents and parents and kids away from their own land (Matt pretends that they didn't have registered deeds or treaties assigning them these lands) to a place that frankly was fairly barren and completely unlike their own home.

It'd be like yanking your parents and grandparents (if they're alive) from wherever they're living and sending them off to walk to Central Mexico to build (by themselves) their houses and new farms.  Oh...and someone will give them a dollar to start rebuilding with.

[Solvedit]

"untaxable wasteland of escaped criminals"?

You mean...  Native American tribes who already lived there?  Big cities like Cahokia with its farms and roads?

No, those people died out.

Most of them, that is, leaving the place empty and nearly undefended for probably quite a few generations. There was at least a risk the place would have started to fill up with non-state actors or even pirates and escaped deck hands and other desperadoes. There is some evidence that it was starting to happen.

This 400 Year Old Cold Case Mystery Solved

Do you not get it?  The only question is who would have taken the Americas if not Europe.  The Ottomans, the Mughals, the Ming, or non-state actors without the power or will to prevent the place from becoming a haven for criminals and pirates.  The people you claim lived in "big cities like Cahokia with its farms and roads" were mostly dead.  

The Ottomans took EVERYONE slaves.  Not just Europeans.

So the Ottomans weren't a grave existential threat to Europeans if they had taken the Americas?  Just because they were also a threat to other parts of the world?

The Barbary Pirates weren't sailing cross ocean in the 1400's. 

You suppose.

And the Vikings discovered America long before that.

So what?

There was no one in America to sell slaves to before 1490.  Selling slaves to the Native Americans would be a waste of time; they had few slaves and didn't have any coinage with which to buy slaves even if they'd wanted them.

So Columbus didn't make the natives gather gold from streams because it wasn't yet minted into coins?  

You might be leaping to the conclusion that slaves had to follow the later pattern established by the plantation owners.  Obviously, no one in the pre-Columbian new world would have wanted to import slaves for labor from far away.  It would obviously not make sense to ship laborers across oceans after losing many men taking them from heavily defended Europe. 

Only high-value slaves would have been shipped and the Ottomans would probably be savvy enough to not let the natives get too much old world technology if the Ottomans planned to start a new caliphate.  

Loxahatches does NOT sound anything like the Arabic phrase. 

It sounds virtually identical if you drop the "a" from "al."

Just because a word "sort of" looks like another word doesn't mean that's how it's sounded or that the second language borrowed it from the first.

So it's circumstantial, ambiguous evidence. Maybe so.

[Bush Master]

[BeTheGoddess]

Got smacked in the head with a 'gidgey' (a 4 pronged spear for fishing). It hit me in the eyebrow, one cm lower and I would have lost an eye.

Anyway go to the clinic to get it sewn up and the doctor was from England and didnt know what a gidgey is, the nurse said was a spear and the doc was "you got speared in the head??'.

Yeah STFU and gimme the oxycontin.

EDIT: we were actually not fishing at the time.

[Bush Master]

[Bush Master]