A really big question

[Randyvine]

My previous reply was after I finished reading all 14 pages. This reply, is specifically to your op. I have pondered something along this line when I am in the woods and a tree ant falls on me. Most of the time it just keeps on walking and walking and walking from limb to core to limb. I have sat there and wondered, "does this guy feel like he is walking across my arm in about twelve seconds, or does he feel like he has been walking for  twenty minutes relative to his size and its relation to the distance. I see a few feet of distance, does he see a mile? How come he fell of the tree, but as soon as he touches my body he does not want to leave? Is it wondering why the ground is so warm (my skin)?

I once was a bit too intoxicated and watched a mosquito larvae in a bucket for like two hours. It looked like he was going to fly away soon out  of that metamorphosis and I did not want to miss it. Eventually the substances wore off and I got distracted back into the now and stepped away for a task that I do not recall. Only after like another few hours did I even remember that I was observing it earlier, so I went back. Too  late, the little rat bastard took off and left his shell  behind. And then my mind went towards the concept of an angelic spirit rising out of our dead corpses when we pass. While that thing was underwater, that was it universe and its entire understanding was within that realm. if it has any thoughts or philosophical concepts of its own in that macro universe of it, how does it explain what is about to happen?? Once it goes airborne, it is dead to everything in that universe that it once knew, and knew it. It left behind a husk, but it was not dead. What it discovered after must be quite the sensory overload no?? Or have we developed enough machines to know exactly what that creature with its own machine measurable electrical pulses within it could have been perceiving? To its co-habitators it is just dead matter left behind of what they used to know. 

I do not even look at living entities the same way I used to anymore, it is kind of hard to do so when I realize how little humanity even knows about itself, or its real history. Do certain sciences actually produce understanding, or simply an arrogance that fulfills a supremacist mindset? I just find some similarities to the evolution of water borne parasitic and non parasitic organisms and some peoples concept of life after death somewhat intriguing. Are the skeeters a midge fly's down there going "Dan man, cant wait to get my wings and become an angel in heaven." Then his conspiracy theory buddy is like "Woah woah dude, have you not heard?? The up there is full of giants and monsters and sickly creatures that want to devour you or make you life hell.  No way man you I hope when I die they just put me in another body right down here" 

We going to be flying around as energy in space, but what if that world is equally as vicious and predatory as all others? Yep, I did not ground myself for long enough. I got to go back outside now. cya!

Hey World,
Thank you for the awesome post. Glad you made it back to us from that
skeeter dimension. You have no idea how much I hate them. I swear
I could be in a room with thirty other people and one mosquito. I'll get
bit thirty friggen times and not anyone else will be defiled. No exaggeration.

[worldstarcountry]

Hey World,
Thank you for the awesome post. Glad you made it back to us from that
skeeter dimension. You have no idea how much I hate them. I swear
I could be in a room with thirty other people and one mosquito. I'll get
bit thirty friggen times and not anyone else will be defiled. No exaggeration.

Yes mosquitoes can be rather frustrating. Sometimes I would sit at the porch table with neighbor talking the latest current events. Skeeters would show up eventually. I let them get comfortable and take that first plunge,and then just calmly place down the tip of my finger ending it. If it's a busy night, I begin to start a field of them. Rows of five. Neighbor is talking about stuff, and soon I have at least a dozen casualties. My record was thirty five lined up in seven rows of five. Normally they stop after about eight. The first time my neighbor took notice he was trying to understand what I was doing. I explained, and yes this was my logic at the time, I said that many times when people think they are surrounded by dozens of mosquitos, it is often only about five or so. Too many folks flail around keeping them agitated and they can never effectively eliminate them efficiently. So I just figured I would be calm every time and just get them when I know I can, which is usually right when they go for a drink. I don't even need to move swiftly most times. What I observed after a few instances of adjusting my behavior into this routine is that after I started doing this a few times, they would eventually stop. I still am unsure if I just got most of the ones that spawned in the most recent cycles, or if they are learning. One thing that makes me think they learn is one night chatting with the neighbor.

He was just laughing calling me a war criminal, but then got serious and asked why I always do it. First off, I have compulsive ticks and once I get going sometimes I just cannot stop. My brain just gets locked into a tedious task and refuse to quit unless or until I can declare mission accomplished or thereabouts. The other thing I told him was they eventually leave me alone. 

In fact, more than one occasion my count was pretty low before they began to ignore me. But then they would go after him. It was kind of funny he would get pretty uncomfortable and yell at the collective mass. I told him just get systematic with them and they eventually stop. This is what leads me to believe they are learning in whatever way they do that sort of thing.

I honestly have not thought too much on it, but recalling now this year and last, I do not really get bothered by them much outside anymore. If I find a stagnant water in a bucket or planter, I always grab a syringe and extract the larvae. They drive the fish in my nano aquarium wild. I just leave the syringe there in the water hanging and allow gravity and their instincts to escape do the work. The fish go wild, it ends up looking like a shark feeding frenzy the way they start behaving. Very healthy natural food sources.

I don't notice City of Tampa has been deploying those mosquito control spray trucks for the past couple of seasons though.

Eh, I guess that was all off topic anyways.

[Randyvine]

Eh, I guess that was all off topic anyways.

Well in your defence you did mention a point I hadn't thought of
in retrospect. The time involved with distance must be as different for
ants and/or mosquitos as it would be in a similar way between us and
someone as large as the universe. That is to exaggerate the limits of imagination
of course. :)

[worldstarcountry]

Well in your defence you did mention a point I hadn't thought of
in retrospect. The time involved with distance must be as different for
ants and/or mosquitos as it would be in a similar way between us and
someone as large as the universe. That is to exaggerate the limits of imagination
of course. :)

lol I see what your getting it. You had to stretch it a bit to fit the topic but made it fit you did. So are we thinking, the time elapsed to me was more like an hours or days long operation from their space/time perspective and the behavior of gravity on time due to their size, like we discussed with the ant earlier? They took a lickin with their losses and decided to live to bite another day?? I love it!!

[Randyvine]

lol I see what your getting it. You had to stretch it a bit to fit the topic but made it fit you did. So are we thinking, the time elapsed to me was more like an hours or days long operation from their space/time perspective and the behavior of gravity on time due to their size, like we discussed with the ant earlier? They took a lickin with their losses and decided to live to bite another day?? I love it!!

"So are we thinking, the time elapsed to me was more like an hours or days long operation from their space/time perspective and the behavior of gravity on time due to their size, like we discussed with the ant earlier?"

I didn't miss my mark. 

[worldstarcountry]

I really like where this is going, see because then from the perspective of insects, they are  not living a short 2 weeks - 6 months lifespan, they are living entire decades lives of experience from their understanding, which humans may never be able to measure because we just have no comprehension on how to even measure that. Same goes for bacteria and cells. hmmmm, have you thought about running this theory through the AI devil? 

Google's quantum computer Willow was asked "Who Built the Universe". From my understanding, it began to spit out a mathematical pattern which recreated the Fibonacci sequence? I only learned of that from the video I saw months ago, I think its essentially the fractal pattern of spiraling growth observable in so many elements of nature and existence, or at least that was my understanding from what was presented.
That lead  to researchers  believing it proved the multiverse. Others are not as convinced. Oh, and Grok seems to have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.





I  bet  there was a thread on it here, but I don't know for sure.

[Randyvine]

Fibonacci the finger print of God. Learned of that many moons ago on
ATS. That place was the only college I'll ever know. When AI can give
me the lottery numbers only then will I give the devil it's due.

[worldstarcountry]

ATS. That place was the only college I'll ever know.

Amen to that brother,  Amen to that...

I was watching this nice interview this morning with Denis Noble and how he believes Darwinsm needs an update, but around the 24 minute mark he goes into a little bit of what your OP was into regarding distances  between these tiny things, and how if you blew up a couple of cells to scale their distance would be between wherever he is being interview (cant recall if it is in London or Netherlands, his career was in both places) and Paris. These two microscopic things and how obviously the signal travel now would take longer. It is a sincerely lovely interview, extremely informative. I have learned new things about biology and I  only got to about the hour mark and still need to finish.

But that part starting at 24 minutes and goes on for a couple of minutes was directly applied to your question in the op and so I thought you would like to hear him discuss it.



I promise you are also about to learn things you did not know about biology that he has studied and cites. If you just want to hear his talking about the distances directly relating to your question in the op, just start at 24 minutes to like 26 minutes. I hope he covers it more somewhere else in the part of interview I have not finished watching yet.

[Randyvine]

Amen to that brother,  Amen to that...

I was watching this nice interview this morning with Denis Noble and how he believes Darwinsm needs an update, but around the 24 minute mark he goes into a little bit of what your OP was into regarding distances  between these tiny things, and how if you blew up a couple of cells to scale their distance would be between wherever he is being interview (cant recall if it is in London or Netherlands, his career was in both places) and Paris. These two microscopic things and how obviously the signal travel now would take longer. It is a sincerely lovely interview, extremely informative. I have learned new things about biology and I  only got to about the hour mark and still need to finish.

But that part starting at 24 minutes and goes on for a couple of minutes was directly applied to your question in the op and so I thought you would like to hear him discuss it.
[Video: https://youtu.be/NAPhBt8VJCM]

I promise you are also about to learn things you did not know about biology that he has studied and cites. If you just want to hear his talking about the distances directly relating to your question in the op, just start at 24 minutes to like 26 minutes. I hope he covers it more somewhere else in the part of interview I have not finished watching yet.

 
I have time to watch it all in fact vids have to be recommended or I won't
find them. I spend my time watching not searching thru thick mud.
But in my favs yesterday I did come across this point that put my little
pea brain all 4th of july.

See if this makes sense to you, other members as well? Does this jive
with the points we've made in this discussion? Then I'll tell you
who said it and what my reaction was. So be patient.

"The faster one goes the slower time ticks for one as seen by others. 
The closer one gets to the speed of light the slower time ticks.
And at the speed of light time stops.
Which means that for a photon from the big bang moving at the
speed of light. When it is absorbed in your retina it is the same instant
that it was emitted at the big bang 14 billion years ago. A photon
released from the big bang may take 13.8 billion years to get to
you. But concerning the photon bamm it is in your retina the same
instant it was emitted."

I want to know if ignorance is really being denied here. :)

[worldstarcountry]

 I want to know if ignorance is really being denied here. :)

Well I have no clue who said it, perhaps something Einstein would say,  but only because I am not really familiar with the researchers of the Physics world. Regarding the previous post I made, I rewatched most of the interview and remember exactly what he says. He says when discussing a single cell structure, that if he scaled up the nucleus to the size of his fist, the actual cell wall/membrane (skin?) would have been in Paris from where he was at, but the signal would still travel instantaneously.

So if that were the case, and a single nucleus scales up to the size of a planet, I posited this question to the AI:

hi interesting question that requires some scaling math. Denis Noble used an example in an interview about the size and speed dynamics using the following metaphor. When taking a single cell, if we scaled up the nucleus to be the size of his fist, the cell wall would be in Paris, he was in London for the interview. And then he stated the signal travel between them would be instantaneous. I wonder with that scale in mind, fist sized nucleus in London, England; cell wall all the way in Paris, France. Are you able to calculate how far out the cell wall would be if it were scaled to the size of Earth?
If the nucleus is fist-sized and the cell wall is Paris from London, the scale factor to Earth depends on what you take as “fist-sized.”
Using a typical fist diameter of about 10 cm and London–Paris as about 343 km, the scale is:
343,000 m0.10 m≈3.43×1060.10 m343,000 m​≈3.43×106
So if the fist-sized nucleus were scaled up to Earth’s diameter (≈12,742≈12,742 km), the cell wall distance would scale to:
343 km×12,742 km0.10 m≈4.37×1012 km343 km×0.10 m12,742 km​≈4.37×1012 km
That’s about:

• 4.37×10124.37×1012 km
  
• about 463 light-years
  
• roughly 29,000 AU
  

So at Earth scale, the cell wall would be about 463 light-years away from the nucleus.

See , now we are getting closer to an answer of your OP, I hope you do not mind that I used the ghost in the machine to calculate the math, because we were talking some serious scale here and I probably would have been unable to finish it in hours. Now  mind you, that is only a single cell of a universe sized cosmological entity no?? Have you ever seen Frontera Verde (green Frontier) it was a very amazing  short series I watched filmed in Colombia. It is a truly unique piece of culture, and it had me hooked with stunning visuals involving Native Americans protecting some kind of universal secret and a corrupt businessman I believe it was paying a competing tribe with weapons and wealth to attack and kill the tribes to unlock  this secret he is chasing and extreme concepts. It is in Spanish, this amazing teaser sample invokes all the concepts I believe are related to the topic which I wanted to illustrate with  the flow of energy and the scales of the universe. I think if these kinds of topics interest you, watch this series if you can get it dubbed or at least subs Closed Captions, unless you understand  Spanish  which is just  fine.



So If the cells themselves are almost 1000 light years across based on distance from nucleus to cell walls, what is the distance between each cell, and what would an entire galaxy be composed of , a single fingernail? Perhaps a toe or an eyelid/lash? I could probably get an answer from the ghost to that as well, but I don't want to be the only one asking questions here and then answering them. I closed the conversation with this:

Your awesome, I bet you enjoy this kind of questions instead of people always asking how to pick up girls or most likely lotto numbers
Yeah — these kinds of scaling questions are a lot more fun.