Let's cut through the BS. Do GUNS kill people, OR...

[KrustyKrab]

I chopped your text there to highlight several points.

Yes, they're tools...but their ONLY purpose is to kill.  I can use a knife to cut meat, carve something, clean fingernails, take a rock out of a horse's hoof, let the air out of a tire, remove a foreign object from a wound, peel a peach, peel a grape, trim back an overly enthusiastic vine from my house, perform an operation, remove an appendix, pry open a jar lid, stir paint, apply paint on a canvas (or somewhere else), apply mortar, carve clay, free a trapped animal, kill a fish...and lots more that I could list if I decided to sit down and try to be comprehensive.

Guns shoot bullets.  Bullets make holes in things.  These holes are designed to Make Things Dead (including paper targets.  Lots of targets give up their lives for bullets.) or to threaten death/injury/violence to someone.

Do I want them totally banned?  Nope.  I can see them useful in a few situations.

But...here's the thing:  many people in support of 2A (who own guns and are responsible) reach for a gun as a first response rather than trying other methods.   If you and I hear a bunch of noise at our front door... and it's night... and someone comes in, you're likely to grab a gun and shoot them.  I would call the cops, turn on the light and the cameras, and grab a wooden sword --because that might be someone who's at the wrong house accidentally or one of my kids surprising me or any number of relatively innocent things.

Guns are for killing.  I don't think you need to bring them to the grocery store (no tomato, in the entire history of the planet, has ever gone berserk in a grocery store and mowed down dozens of people along with their service dogs.)  I think that if you're a hunter or if you're trekking in the backwoods, a gun is absolutely a self-defense tool that you need.

You are also assuming that the guns are in the hands of people like yourself... and not in the hands of people who stole them from people like yourself.  If you want the numbers, the best I've got is that between 2017 and 2021, roughly 2 million guns in America were involved in crime  The people using those guns aren't like you or me, but they're getting the guns from people like you and me.  They even steal them from Border Agents to use in crimes

You're not thinking about them in terms of teenagers with grudges (like the one who killed so many students in Uvalde, Texas.

And that's the difference.  You're thinking of people like you, who are responsible and not quick to take offense.  We're thinking of friends and family who committed suicide, of criminals like the ones above, of street gangs, of gun owners who kill other family members, of teens wanting revenge on bullies and others.  When we ask "how do we deal with the above" the responses we get seem to be things like "arm the teachers" and "get another gun"... more killing and more death.

It doesn't seem to be a solution.  If we say "licensing and databases" the counterargument is "it's already a law" (but the counter to that is that 2A prone lawmakers often overturn these laws.)

I can understand that someone might want to have fun shooting a high capacity magazine (doesn't sound like fun to me, but... hey, whatever floats your boat) and would have no problem with licensed gun ranges having them for rent to use inside their facility.  They're pretty useless for hunting, but great for making lots of noise.

It'd be great if Americans could be acculturated to the idea that the first response to a threat (or someone cutting you off in traffic) is NOT to get out a gun and go after someone.

There's a reason gun laws were passed in the first place (and a reason why, after the Mafia gang wars, machine guns were outlawed for civilians.)  There's a reason why some towns in the Old West didn't allow guns.  There's a reason why military bases don't allow open carry (or weapons carry unless you've been issued it for a specific reason.)

And no, the gunman and his friends and a stockpile of weapons won't hold off an army...as Ukraine has shown.


...Wow... got kind of long-winded there, didn't I?  Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.  :)

Good luck with your wooden sword against someone breaking into your home to take your stuff and willing to kill you and your family if anyone gets in the way. You’ll be dead by the time the cops get there, that is if you even make it to a phone in time.

Just my opinion but I think it’s somewhat ignorant to not have a gun for self defense in today’s day n age and putting yourself in a position of being defenseless usually won’t end well for you. I’ve heard to many cases where homeowners lived because they had a gun. I know a couple of stories firsthand of people close to me that wouldn’t be here without a firearm.

With society getting more brazen and out of control and the mere fact criminals and gang members are armed to the teeth, my gun isn’t going anywhere. But I guess if you want to play the lottery and possibly find yourself in a situation of being completely defenseless, you do you. But there could come a time where you’d wish you had one.

BTW: Yes, people have shot people in all kinds of stores, grocery stores included. 10 people murdered at a buffalo grocery store a couple of years ago. 4 people murdered 9 wounded at a Arkansas grocery store just a few months ago. 10 murdered at a grocery store in Boulder a few years ago. So, yes they happen more frequently than you think.

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Guns kill people like forks make you fat.

Bigger issue is do governments oppress and kill people after they disarm their citizens?

Short answer…yes
1911: Turkey; citizens disarmed – 1.5 million Armenians were slaughtered
1929: Russia; citizens disarmed – 20 million Russians murdered
1935: China; citizens disarmed – 20 million Chinese killed
1938: Germany; citizens disarmed – 6 million Jews murdered
1956: Cambodia; citizens disarmed – 1 million “intellectuals” killed
1964: Guatemala; citizens disarmed – 100,000 Mayan Indians massacred
1970: Uganda; citizens disarmed – 300,000 Christians put to death

You can throw Venezuela in their too, as well as Ukraine for giving up their nukes to Russia for guaranteed security from Russia. That didn’t age well for them, extremely bad call in hindsight.

Ugh there’s that 2 post different people, won’t separate from 1 post glitch again. Is that getting fixed? Sure is annoying.