Columbia University has fallen

[Notran]

First of all, FCD Im just discussing this, It's not a matter of me accepting anything it's called a discussion. I have no problem with the thread morphing into the broader Israeli/Palestinian question but, suffice it to say there is plenty of straw being strewn in this thread. 

Im not making wild proclamations all Im doing is bringing the discourse on the topic Ive seen elsewhere to Deny Ignorance and discuss with people who mostly want to hear their opinions. These types of informative discussions are no longer possible in other places. No more no less. 

It is not my intention to irritate you or get you worn out over this, this isn't Im right about your wrong situation, I value your opinion even if I disagree on some points. Im not trying to change anybody's mind all the while Im open that I could be wrong. 

So respectively here are my responses 

The article below was just from December, certainly not all Palestinians actively support Hamas, but enough do that it's a real threat to Israel. Thats the REALITY of whether it's acceptable to anybody

Unless one prescribes to any means necessary argument, which tries to rationalize and validate 10/7. This attitude is prevalent across our campuses and definitely in the Middle East.

Respectfully there was no way Israel could have sent SF units to find the hostages and rescue them, without incurring huge losses specifically because ENOUGH Gazans and Palestinians support Hamas which makes it dangerous as hell for a limited and surgical operation. 

https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-...3844bc4514
 Palestinian poll shows a rise in Hamas support and close to 90% wanting US-backed Abbas to resign 
 
Here's another more recent article..

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-eas...024-06-13/Poll shows rise in support by Palestinians for armed struggle

I was under the impression that Mandatory Palestine was rejected by the Arab population in 1948, thus the problem. 

but it's this quote that concerns me, it skews the reality that all sides the Palestinians and Hamas including both routinely deploy delaying tactics, misrepresentations, and outright lies.  

Want it to end?  release the hostages, Im sure plenty of Palestinians know exactly where they are.

We can argue a percentage are scared or intimidated, but not all. Respectfully if it's 10% that's 230,000 Palestinians celebrating 10/7 too the extreme. 

Much like the Palestinians in UNRWA not all were complicit but enough are that it seriously hinders any semblance of what it's supposed to accomplish in Gaza. The same goes for whatever percentage of Palestinians support Hamas, all those tunnels from Rafah to Egypt weren't going to the Bedouin, somebody was supporting Hamas from Egypt, are they part of the negotiations? 

RESPECTFULLY sure it can, which side has stalled negotiations more since October? hell Ive seen Israel accept proposals recently where Hamas pulled back. 

Ive got more a little more

such as snap your fingers BOOM the Palestinians have complete autonomy in the 1948 Mandatory Palestine what happens with Israel? Let's not pretend Jews are assimilated into Arab countries even close to the degree Muslims are assimilated in Israel. So we negotiate and are we supposed to naively believe there won't be terroristic attacks once the Palestinian statehood is established, and the inevitable Israeli responses? 

here's where I do get stuck and I can't get past it FCD

If you think you are worn out imagine the parents of these women, it's hard for a father in me to get past this. Id Ross Perot this shit if my daughter was left behind for Pally statehood negotiations, at least the Iranians didn't do this yes some of the women were soldiers, but it's still no excuse or rationale to violate the Geneva Convention if you want to be recognized with statehood. None, zero, zip, nada. 

How do you negotiate with that while it's still occurring?  

Im of the opinion Hamas had no idea that 10/7 would garner them so many captives, one reason they had to hide them with UN Doctors and according to your posts ordinary Palestinians. That 10% 250,000 approximately seems to be complicit. 

https://nypost.com/2024/06/14/world-news...tive-says/

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So tell me again about luxury car dealerships in open-air prisons and concentration camps? Hell Ive seen worse suffering in Mississippi and scarier places in New Orleans, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, DC, and Philly and Chicago.

[Video: https://youtu.be/PMcPrjc7YVM?si=cicEEAPaG0EaPvda]


[Video: https://youtu.be/ZQnzHNZojcw?si=TglFJlzIgZXb457F]

I don't understand what you're trying to say I am afraid. What luxury car dealerships??

I do understand you don't have much to say and you left without good arguments to counter my post.

If you want to get an understanding on what is to live in an open air prison/concentration camp then you must listen to the interviews by Norman Flinkenstein who is a Jewish intellectual and among the many Jewish who accuse Israel of war crimes, crimes against humanity, and genocide.

Perhaps you should listen Jewish people all over the world who condemn the government of Israel, the Israeli occupation of Gaza and the West Bank, and the war crimes commited by Israel.

It could be it's inconvenient for your narrative, I get this. But I don't understand what you're trying to do. Are you trying to whitewash the crimes commited by Israel?

Israel is to get investigated for war crimes, crimes against humanity, and possibly genocide.

Everyone stands against atrocities (most people to be precise). But if you can't see and realise Israel is an occupying force committing war crimes and crimes against humanity then you should ask yourself why is it you are resistant and can't accept the facts.