+- Deny Ignorance (https://denyignorance.com)
+-- Forum: Science, Mystery, & Paranormal (https://denyignorance.com/Forum-Science-Mystery-Paranormal)
+--- Forum: Science & Technology (https://denyignorance.com/Forum-Science-Technology)
+--- Thread: Long Covid does more than sicken you... (/Thread-Long-Covid-does-more-than-sicken-you)
Long Covid does more than sicken you... - Maxmars - 03-29-2024
This is a story about more than just COVID (or the COVID-like vaccine experience) so settle your personal baggage and read on.
First a note about what some doctors are seeing with long-COVID... something most who were infected or pseudo exposed via vaccine may have experienced...
From National Geographic: Long COVID can destroy your ability to exercise. Now we know why.
From Nature: Muscle abnormalities worsen after post-exertional malaise in long COVID
People who suffer long-COVID have been showing signs of problems which seem to defy "healing."
While many accept and subscribe to the notion that reasonable 'exercise and activity' offers the body a chance to heal and recover from illness. Some long COVID sufferers are further afflicted by being unable to exert themselves without becoming exhausted and not recovering despite resting... they never recover from the fatigue. Doctors have now actually identified the physical damage and verified its extent.
A distinctive symptom of patients with long COVID is post-exertional malaise, which is associated with a worsening of fatigue- and pain-related symptoms after acute mental or physical exercise, but its underlying pathophysiology is unclear.
For many people with long COVID, a major symptom is difficulty with exercising, because when these patients push past their limits it can lead to a devastating cycle of fatigue that boosts the risk of worsening their condition.
These issues with exercise, which is known as post-exertional malaise (PEM), are also the defining symptoms of myalgic encephalomyelitis / chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS).
Now a new study, published in the journal Nature Communications, provides an explanation for this feeling of exhaustion, suggesting that patients with long COVID experience a range of changes in their body after exercising, including widespread muscle damage, changes in muscle composition, and disrupted energy metabolism.
This study “actually shows the damage” to the body that is being caused by post-exertional malaise, says Lucinda Bateman, a physician at the Bateman Horne Center, who specializes in treating patients with ME/CFS and long COVID. As Bateman notes, this includes showing “the inflammation, the damage, the scarring, the clots,” which are all found in the muscles of long COVID patients. Researchers also found differences in the activity of the mitochondria—the body’s microscopic energy factories—following exercise.
(underline is mine)
It appears the patient's suffering from long COVID actually damage themselves when they try to 'get fit' by exercising. What's worse, the damage caused by exercise actually makes it harder to recover... and depletes their energy over the long term.
“Normally we know from all the other chronic diseases that exercise is good for you, that exercise is medicine,” Wüst says. “However, these patients do get worse.”
The data is in...
Evidence of this impaired exercise recovery was also seen in muscle tissue of long COVID patients in the Nature Communications study—signs of muscle scarring, inflammation, and blood clots, both before and after the exercise. “We saw a lot of muscle damage, and signs that there has been damage in the past,” Wüst says.
This damage is thought to be the result of multiple bouts of post-exertional malaise, which is then compounded by an impaired ability to recover.
While this is a terrible effect of the disease, at least we now have a starting point in learning how to manage recovery without making it worse.
RE: Long Covid does more than sicken you... - DontTreadOnMe - 03-29-2024
Thanks for that information, MM.
In addition to the damage done to the muscles, it also can manifest as muscle atrophy.
RE: Long Covid does more than sicken you... - argentus - 03-29-2024
Yes. One of my dear friend's husband was stricken with what she thinks is Long Covid. He has a myriad of symptoms which only occurred in the past couple of years. The horrible thing is that LC cannot be tested for. They continue to wrangle his illnesses, and it is super difficult, because none of his symptoms can be really measured. That is the nature of LC. It is a complete sonofabitch.
In late December 2019, a vicious flu went through our community. Many people were hospitalized. It was the sickest I can ever recall being -- very high fever, coughing, just really crappy bodily aches, felt like complete crap. Usually, I bundle up, take on lots of fluids and I help my immune system burn out the virus; I am usually really sick for three days and then the fever breaks and I quickly recover. Not this time. I was sick for weeks, which was really very unusual for me. Two friends of mine who are nurses later believed that was the initial onset of Covid. MANY people I talked with still remember how sick they were, and how the symptoms lingered.
I had a phlegmy cough which lingered for more than two years. Went to the hospital, had lots of testing, blood samples, sputum samples, etc. Nothing. I took NAC and that helped a LOT. I still had the cough, but it was much less debilitating. We were all leveraged into taking the vax. Me, because I had to travel, and my Darlin' because she wanted to get whatever I got, and Mom because she didn't want to be left behind. We chose AstraZeneca, a semi-normal viral vector vax instead of the mRNA.
Last October, me, my Darlin' and my Mom all got another flu. It was a biotch. We were all sicker than dogs. I did my usual bundling up, and I got over it in about five days. My Darlin' and Mom were sick for weeks, but eventually recovered. Somehow my immune system kicked the ass of whatever was causing my phlegmy cough. It has been gone ever since then. I wish I could get this information to someone who truly gave a crap about virology, because while being anecdotal information and not measurable, I can't help thinking that it might be important.
RE: Long Covid does more than sicken you... - Kenzo - 03-30-2024
The post-exertional malaise is also in lyme disease .
There are some/few so called " stealth pathogens out there , lyme being one .
I might dare to theorize that it possible people with long covid might been carriers of one or more stealth pathogens , and something then triggered them to start being real ass .....that something as viral infection, extra stress etc..
I ordered 2 weeks ago Persister Desister Long Term Lyme Disease Support Kit , because i really suspect having lyme. Did not yet reveived it, slow package it seems.... it will be interesting to see does it help.
RE: Long Covid does more than sicken you... - putnam6 - 03-30-2024
Any autoimmune disease has almost debilitating fatigue side effects. IIRC. Bottom line the danger was way overblown vaccines and limited exposure for the elderly and at risk and we would have been fine.
Sorry it will be a long time before I believe one report over another from our doctors and government
not a Bill Maher fan but he isn't wrong
https://x.com/VigilantFox/status/1773916...16505?s=20
A lot of the dissenting opinions that were suppressed and ridiculed at the time have proven to be CORRECT.” This includes, but is not limited to:
• COVID came from a lab
• Ivermectin worked
• Masks offered no benefit and were harmful
• Should have never kept kids out of school
• Natural immunity is better than vaccinated immunity
• Long COVID is often a symptom of long vax
• Hospitals murdered COVID patients
• COVID fatality rate and death count were highly inflated
• Unvaccinated were scapegoated for the failure of the shots
• Early treatment was suppressed to make way for a “vaccine”
• Risks of the jab were intentionally hidden from the public
• Vaccine mandates are wrong • More shots = more risk of infection
• COVID shots are neither safe nor effective
https://x.com/VigilantFox/status/1773916265138016505?s=20
RE: Long Covid does more than sicken you... - Maxmars - 03-30-2024
I have an impulse to comment on your list...
• COVID came from a lab
While the mainstream remains reticent to even seriously address this "theory," they have simultaneously definitively demonstrated that being commercially beholden (addicted) to pharmaceutical advertising money makes them unreasonable to trust (even if they were remotely trusted to begin with.) The government's over-the-top nosedive into social engineering and information control also scoured away any 'trustworthiness' they may have had.
The well-documented history of research into adapting existing non-human viruses kind of spoils their defense of "It's racist to say so!" and "No good scientist would ever do that!" The Wuhan lab has a terrible track record when it comes to 'protocols and safety (look it up.) Add to this the in-your-face line, oft repeated and even offered up as evidentiary testimony "It wasn't 'gain of function research!" and you have to start wondering how they ever thought they could just 'talk their way out of it."
• Ivermectin worked
Apparently, it did. But could you imagine the angst and grief the accountants would have suffered if they 'lost' out on profit? No cheap, easily available, pharmaceutically proved and tested therapy for us... experimental MRNA manipulation ho! More 'product sales' means more profit... mandate that sucker!
• Masks offered no benefit and were harmful
That's not really fair. Masks do have a benefit... just not outside of surgery and hospital infectious disease wards. Most doctors knew this from the get go. Unless you are willing to exchange your used mask for a new one every half hour, and avoid contagion areas, and never - ever - wear one when you're sick... it is all an exercise in futility. Masks were never the blessing they were sold to be... except for investors in the industry. (That and hand sanitizer.)
• Should have never kept kids out of school
True. Children were never a viable vector for this disease. Between the robust nature of their immune responses, and the generally minimized symptoms... we should have allowed what worked for every single other flu to happen again. Shutting down the social lives of children, and subjecting them to 'tele-teaching' was a mistake of huge proportions.
• Natural immunity is better than vaccinated immunity
Up until COVID, vaccines worked to engender the development of "natural" immunity. Now that the definition of 'vaccine' has been changed to include MRNA treatment that is no longer true. Since 'appearances' now matter more than reality... natural immunity is anti-marketing...and thus hate speech.
• Long COVID is often a symptom of long vax
There are many instances of diseases that have manifested in "long lasting" form. That COVID is like that is simply the way of the human body responding to it. The jury is still out regarding post COVID-vaccine effects, and that is largely because technically the COVID "vaccine" is new technology - it is called a vaccine so it could take advantage of existing regulatory frameworks. The fact that they rushed to "change" the definition of the term "Vaccine" says it all.
• Hospitals murdered COVID patients
Again, somewhat unfair. By that same reasoning every hospital 'murders' many people due to their ignorance, worship of "policy," and reliance on "insurance banks" to validate treatment. I have to agree that automatic "intubation" seemed like a practice they should shamed for. Casual intubation is often a precursor to "giving up" on the patient.
• COVID fatality rate and death count were highly inflated
Another reason that the public lost faith in "medical authorities"... some level of collusion was not only present but led to hospitals being "compensated" for identifying COVID cases... and miraculously influenza was rendered extinct once the frenzy of COVID cases reporting was manufactured. But they didn't even flinch at the chance to earn some loyalty dollars.
• Unvaccinated were scapegoated for the failure of the shots
I saw some evidence of the idea that if there was still COVID in the world, it was because people refused the experimental 'vaccine.' But it soon fell apart when they were forced to admit it neither prevented the disease, nor stopped its transmission... so authorities opted for the appearance that they had "saved millions" and rendered the disease a tolerable malady... like it wasn't already.
• Early treatment was suppressed to make way for a “vaccine”
The focus on "vaccine, vaccine, vaccine" was another "in your face" technique used to manufacture an idea that it was the "only way" to 'save us all.' Anything that promised hope beyond that was automatically targeted for attack by the media and the government. Proof of the theory that "money talks."
• Risks of the jab were intentionally hidden from the public
It was easy to ignore the 'risks' because it was an 'emergency' and was an 'experimental' solution. I can only pray that it wasn't as damaging to every recipient as was feared. "Intentionally" is easy to justify when you live by the rule that "the experts" have spoken... (and by experts I mean the appointees and pharma spokespersons who had apparently been elevated into sainthood.
• Vaccine mandates are wrong
I'm not so sure this is a statement that is true at face value. It may be that vaccines are a good thing. "Experimental" treatments shoe-horned into the 'vaccine' designation not so much. But time will tell.
• More shots = more risk of infection
I hadn't heard this assertion before. I hope it's not so, but I wouldn't be surprised if it proves that despite the "doesn't stop the infection, doesn't stop the spread, and only helps when you get it" thing isn't actually a distraction from a depopulation agenda. COVID is a very bad flu. It is most dangerous if your weak, or weakened by other conditions... whether it makes you more likely to suffer the illness itself needs to be proven clinically... has it?
• COVID shots are neither safe nor effective
I characterize the "safe and effective" trope as a cruel joke... it's more like "sudden and unexpected."
There... impulse satisfied...
While I am not a celebrity follower, Mahers comments are mostly on the mark... although I can't say that I agree with everything he said.
RE: Long Covid does more than sicken you... - putnam6 - 03-31-2024
Apologizes Maxmars I'm aware I did exactly what you didn't want to happen
I hesitated to say anything but I stumbled across the Maher video and IMPULSIVELY it seemed apropos.
The list isn't my list it's just from the post on X, like you I agree with some and not so much with others.
Not denying COVID, long COVID, or the vaccine's efficacy and need for those at RISK. My sister and her husband were both hit with COVID, she was hospitalized briefly.
Im just not a fan of how much influence Big Pharma had on the COVID saga, and how it was presented to the public. Its almost like long COVID is the fallback position.
Generally, like Maher says we overreacted, which has made people skeptical AH. Me included
Every generation has its new medical condition we need to be concerned about, hypertension was big in the 70s, 80s AIDS, Cancer, 2000s we had fibromyalgia, 2020 we have COVID and long COVID.
Of course, all of them are real it's just you have to question the numbers and actual risk. Like my Dad(RIP) said everything seems to cause cancer, worrying about getting cancer causes cancer.
and yes on COVID which has only been active about 2018-2019 I'm concerned we need long-term data, you can't just get in 2-3 years.
Well unless you are a lab in Wuhan.
Thus I cast a wary eye on any reports, articles, or conclusions, all thats missing is the directive to get vaccinated
Anything respiratory-related can have dozens of mitigating factors, 4-5 weeks ago I could breathe fine, but now with the allergens my sinuses are cemented shut. Of course, if I were to have even a mild form of COVID it would exacerbate the situation
