(07-16-2024, 02:53 PM)Maxmars Wrote: It has begun...

Normally I would have placed this in the "Propaganda" forum.

From FOX: Secret Service increased Trump's security recently over intel of Iranian assassination plot

Remember what I mentioned earlier in this thread, "Never let a crisis go to waste?"

They pick NOW to bring up the notion of an Iranian plot?  They pick NOW to "add that" to the conversation.  Why?

Of course the Iranians, and most every other US antagonist, has "chattered" about killing Trump... AND Biden... and a slew of other people they hate.  Hell, even our own CIA harbors many assassination-plots of elite-players in their back pocket. It's what these people do... they always have.  

Is this because they want to offer public information that the Secret Service is "always on the lookout" and had "sufficient" attention to the physical safety of this candidate (and former President?)  Is it a need to increase 'confidence' in them, and ward off any uncomfortable questions about exactly what culture lurks within the Secret Service now?  Is the taint of covert partisan alignment now to be found even within the body of the Secret Service, even as it is manifesting elsewhere?

I suspect there's more distraction to come...

Welcome to the first one I found.

(07-16-2024, 03:27 PM)StevieRay Wrote: I’m not sure where, but I think I read something about the snipers / others asking for directions during the 30-40 minutes the shooter was wandering around, and getting none from their supervisor.

On the Blackrock thing, I can just imagine them “helping to get students involved” in various things, and accidentally “getting to know” a few of the most disturbed/ easily manipulated kids in the school.

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ATS is saying that Garland is blocking congressional investigation.

If true, it’s just madness, and insanely blatant.

They’re gonna stay in kill mode, or this is the thing that many will hang for, with a Trump win.

(07-16-2024, 03:51 PM)Waterglass Wrote: Heres another two videos that I had not seen before. I was looking for LiveLeak.com that is now Itemfix.com. Heres a video behind Trump when he was shot

https://www.itemfix.com/list?q=trump+shooting+

Heres another. Whats up with the green farm tractor spewing something @ the 12 second mark of the video? 

https://www.itemfix.com/v?t=9048fs

Would love to hear your thoughts.

(07-16-2024, 06:02 PM)KKLoco Wrote: On a side note, it’s nice to see the crazies haven’t infiltrated DI like on ATS. I am sick and tired of the ‘Trump staged this to guarantee a victory!’ Bullshit on that board. It’s absolutely ridiculous to think he, or his camp, would stage bullets flying by his damn head — from a 20 year old outcast, nonetheless. 

I’m also repulsed by the reactions of some people directly after this happened. I watched it live. Within minutes, I text my best friend in Portland, OR. He was on a walk with his dog and next door neighbor. He called me 20 minutes later. He said that when he informed his neighbor of what I told him, the neighbors response was ‘Did he get him?’ When my friend replied ‘no’, the neighbor was incredibly disappointed. 

THEN, two hours later, I had one of my tour guides come back from a tour. I did not know his political affiliation. All I did was notify him of what happened. He did not know. And what do you know — he had the same response as my friends neighbor.

I find these responses ABSOLUTELY DISGUSTING and DISTURBING! 

As an example: I hate Biden’s guts! NO SERIOUSLY - I REALLY DO! I project my losses (due to Brandon policies) in the last 3.5 years, in the half MILLION $ range. I REALLY hate him! HOWEVER, I have never ONCE wished that someone would kill him. Have I wished he would die of old age - ABSOLUTELY! But NEVER did I wish someone would take him out!

There are fine lines when we speak of fairness and morality.!

I called my friend back later Saturday, to tell him that I received the same response from my employee about being disappointed he wasn’t murdered. He told me I should have done this:

[Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AJndhBGlZc]

I fucking love my friend, wish I would have thought of it - BRILLIANCE!!!

(07-16-2024, 07:20 PM)KKLoco Wrote: Good Gawd Damn!

New footage of SS agents and LEO’s barricaded behind a fence. LEO vehicle had to ram the fence to free them. Ironically, these look like the dudes that SHOULD have been on Trump’s personal detail.

https://x.com/the_typical_lib/status/1813284903150109076

(07-16-2024, 07:34 PM)KKLoco Wrote: Agreed. This was the ancillary unit. It seems like ‘planned’ delays.

We need boots on the ground in PA. I know there are many on ATS. I’m confused why no one near that region has gone to investigate. First order of business: was the ladder fixed or temporary? There are so many SIMPLE questions that haven’t been confirmed…..

(07-16-2024, 09:45 PM)Maxmars Wrote: I think we are too quickly moved out of context by a seemingly well-directed media narrative.

I am no expert on graphics, but I do know that any manipulation you can conceive of is possible now.  So that specter of "maybe not" is never going to vanish.  If you think it impossible to fake, and that is him, it makes little progress towards the reason this played out as it did.  I can't attribute anything more than hormones and grooming to get to the point of "Go out there, kill a President, and then be killed."  By the way, I was expecting some form of 'manifesto' to be found... which goes to show you how "programmed" I am.

As we gravitate from the context of the shooter himself, the vistas for distraction are endless.  I would playfully suggest that paying close attention to the shooter is not a favorite talking point of the authorities.

(07-17-2024, 01:32 AM)FlyingClayDisk Wrote: I think there's a much simpler explanation than all the crazy conspiracy theories circulating about, and it all makes sense if you look at all the available info. I'll list the main points first, and then add detail to each one afterwards (kind of a TL;DR approach)

1.) The shooter (not going to glorify his name) fantasized about shooting Trump, but wasn't really serious.

2.) The shooter was not alone at the rally. No accomplices, he just wasn't at the rally by himself. He was with a group of peers. (There's proof)

3.) The firearm was stashed at, or nearby, the building he climbed onto well before the rally.

4.) The ladder to climb up on the building was not placed by the shooter.

5.) He had been radicalized by some group over the past couple years.

6.) The shooter had some sort of a mental snap shortly after the rally began.

7.) The delays in neutralizing the shooter are a tragic comedy of errors due to serious security lapses by the SS (and conflicting directions and chaos after he was spotted).

Okay, so here's what I believe went down...

Points #1 and #5 - As has been noted by numerous sources the shooter was endlessly bullied when younger. Over the past couple years he began to gain his identity and acceptance by associating with a group of radicals (possibly coworkers or friends). As many of us have seen there is increasingly violent statements being made in social media and various MSM outlets. Over time the shooter developed a hatred for Trump and had fantasies of taking him out. This would have (in his mind) made all his radical associates accept him even more (as twisted as this is), but he never really believed he would actually do it. It was merely a fantasy (but one he would come close to acting out). I've actually seen this kind of behavior (not about killing people, but just secretly living out some secret fantasy in real life).

Point #2 - There is now proof he was not alone. KKLoco posted a link earlier in this thread. There is a video of a woman screaming his name after he climbed on the roof. She screams..."CROOKS...get over here! What are you DOING???...and she continues repeatedly screaming this same statement several times, even after he is shot. After he is shot, you can hear her screaming the same thing, but now she's sobbing (because she likely realizes he's just been fatally shot.) In the same video you can hear several others screaming the same thing; they're not as loud as the girl screaming, but they're all screaming at him by name. The fact they all refer to him as "CROOKS" likely means they are not parents or siblings, just associates or friends. He was at the rally in a group. These weren't accomplices (other than maybe agitators); he acted alone, but he wasn't at the rally alone.

Point #3 - He stashed the firearm at the rally site before the rally (possibly even days before). We know this by the tone of the woman screaming in item #2 above. If you listen to her voice, she sounds astonished and distraught. It's like she's truly surprised that he's acting out on something they may have snidely or sarcastically discussed. She sounds stunned that he's apparently walked away from the group (thus the "Get over here!" statement). 'Here' where the rest of the group he was with is; she's telling him to come back. It made his fantasy seem real to him.

Point #4 - There are numerous pictures (even here on ATS) of the ladder in place on the side of the building before the rally. It does appear to be attached in some fashion to the building. Even if it was attached, it is not installed per any Building Code in the US, so it wasn't professionally installed there, but it was there before the event. The shooter likely knew this, and figured this would be his way to get a good spot to shoot from. The shooter also stashed the rifle nearby this ladder (again, ahead of time). In his fantasy, he would retrieve it the day of the rally, climb the ladder to the roof and carry out his twisted plan. But, he never believed in his heart he could actually do it. Regardless, stashing the rifle made it all seem real to him. Plus it probably got his adrenaline rushing doing it.

Point #5 - Already covered in item #1, but just to add...the group he was with at the rally are likely part of the peer group he was radicalized by. They likely spewed non-stop hatred for Trump and he just became crazed after a while by peer pressure and the desire to be accepted. They may have intended to be protesters at the event, or were planning on causing some sort of disruption. The screaming girl/woman recorded on video calling him by name and telling him to come back was a member of these radicals. She was yelling at him to come "back" to the group.

Point #6 - At some point shortly after the rally began, possibly because of all the noise, and all the strong support for Trump he just snapped and walked away from the group he was with. He may have even told them ahead of time what he'd done, but no one believed him. In any case, he snapped and suddenly decided to make his fantasy become real. Sort of a..."F*** IT! My life sucks, Why not?...kind of moment. He then walked away from the group, grabbed the rifle, climbed up on the roof and began carrying out his twisted fantasy. It was then that members of the group he was with saw him up on the roof and became increasingly distraught. When the screaming woman saw he really did have a rifle after all, she really started screaming even louder. She continues screaming until after he is shot at which point she is sobbing.

Point #7 - The delays in taking the shooter out are simply explained as just a series of screw ups by both the SS and the LEO's. People reporting things to the LEO's on the ground, conflicting radio calls back and forth trying to verify which roof, and whether the shooter was really not actually an LEO. I've seen this kind of radio confusion a million times. Fragments of radio calls, incomplete information, conflicting directions and mass confusion. There is absolutely NO excuse for this, and people should be held accountable, but it doesn't change the fact that these things frequently happen, especially when people get excited and/or start to panic.

Conclusion - When one of the LEO's got boosted (by another LEO) up to the edge of the roof, and the shooter saw him, the shooter turned and pointed the rifle at the LEO. This was the turning point for the shooter. Right at that second he was committed to doing something; in his mind he had no choice but to act because his life was about to be ended. He likely knew, no matter what, he was going to get shot, so he started firing. If the LEO hadn't peered over the edge of the roof, the shooter most likely would have stayed there for a while longer before shooting (and may not even fired at all), but when the LEO popped up the fantasy ended immediately and reality set in. Everything was going to be over in a few seconds and he knew it. So, he pulled the trigger.

I'll be willing to bet a chicken dinner that when the final story comes out, what I've laid out above will be pretty close to, if not almost exactly, what happened.

My assessment is the authorities need to find out exactly who the screaming girl/woman was, and who the group was which the shooter was with, and authorities need to seriously question these individuals. They hold the key to what happened at the rally July 13th.

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All except for the counter-sniper team who took out the shooter, the entire rest of the response was an absolute clown show to be perfectly honest.  It would be hard for a bunch of kids playing Airsoft to do a worse job.  If it wasn't so serious, I'd say the whole thing qualifies for an episode of the Keystone Kops.

I sincerely hope every agency involved has a very serious AAR debrief and dressing down.  There's just no excuse!  I mean, it's almost too difficult to list all the things which were done wrong, and would be easier to just list the one or two things they actually got right.

The Secret Service completely OWNS this failure, top to bottom.  There is just no, zero, excuse for this complete and utter failure.  They were in charge, without exception...and they failed miserably.

(07-17-2024, 09:47 AM)KKLoco Wrote: Now being reported by Dan Bongino (ex SS) that local PD was supposed to have a sniper on the roof Crooks was on, but they didn’t show up. Video in link.

https://www.rvmnews.com/2024/07/bongino-source-secret-service-cover-up-coming-from-the-top-video/

Quote:His father, meanwhile, told law enforcement he assumed his son had gone to the shooting range at the the Clairton Sportsmen's Club to practice, taking the dad's rifle, and would be back by 1pm on Saturday, CNN reported. 

But as time went on he grew more concerned and phoned local law enforcement. 

At around 3pm on Saturday, Crooks was spotted at the rally's security screening area and tried to pass through metal detectors with the rangefinder, which is used by shooters to measure distance. 

The device, which looks like a small pair of binoculars, would not have prevented him getting into the rally but did put him on law enforcement's radar. 

Witnesses said he was acting strangely, furiously checking his phone and operating the rangefinder.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13644511/Trump-shooter-Thomas-Matthew-Crooks-seen-rally-HOUR-shooting-shocking-new-video.html

(07-17-2024, 10:41 AM)KKLoco Wrote: Finally got a better pic of the ladder. It is not fixed to the building. It’s a 12 foot step ladder. I thought it looked like it widened at the end in the other photos.

[Image: https://i.imgur.com/LE9xknJ.png]

(07-17-2024, 07:14 PM)l0st Wrote: How did he know it would take a 12' step ladder to get on that roof? He measured it before? Worked in construction? A "12'" ladder in the US isn't actually 12'. If you buy a 25' ladder it's more like 20' at full extension, since you'll be about 5' on the second rung from the top. And yes, that's the way ladders are sold here for anyone who didn't know.

(07-17-2024, 10:51 AM)KKLoco Wrote: Well looky what we have here. Posted by Cherokeetroy on ATS.

[Image: https://i.imgur.com/kIWsAS8.jpeg][Image: https://i.imgur.com/hXpAYi4.jpeg]

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How the hell did he get the ladder there? I’m totally confused. We have reports of a conversion van with AZ plates being towed away. Yet, they are reporting he showed up to the event in a Hyundai. No way in hell a 12 foot ladder fits into a Hyundai…..

(07-17-2024, 07:19 PM)l0st Wrote: I generally agree with you but a Hyundai what? Hyundai makes trucks, vans, and busses, even if they are not common in the US. A friend of mine just bought a Hyundai bus from Japan and had it shipped to LATAM. BTW, where he is, it's almost all US vehicles, so this bus is a rarity, even there.