The Uncanny Valley

[Kurokage]

No, it's not some weird gen Z camp or haunted hollow!

The term 'The Uncanny Valley' was first introduced by professor Masahiro Mori in his book back in the 1970s. The effect is a hypothesized psychological and aesthetic relation between an object's degree of resemblance to a human being and the emotional response to the object. 

There's a few ideas as to why we find something that looks 'oodly' human uncomfortable.

Does it possibly stem from the fear of death and the dead, maybe out of fear of disease from a rotting corpse. An infested looking dead body could harm us, so over the thousands of years of evolution, we developed a repulsion to an 'off' looking person?? 
Or could it have developed very early in our evolution, at some point in our development we evolved along side other more possibly aggressive 'cousins' who may have hunted and prayed on us? So along side things like the fear of the dark, was the fear of an unfamiliar 'human' part of our reason to have survived whilst other upright apes disappeared?
This is a fear experienced by the majority of the human race, so must have a evolutionary reason behind it??


From wiki..

Mori's original hypothesis states that as the appearance of a robot is made more human, some observers' emotional response to the robot becomes increasingly positive and empathetic, until it becomes almost human, at which point the response quickly becomes strong revulsion. However, as the robot's appearance continues to become less distinguishable from that of a human being, the emotional response becomes positive once again and approaches human-to-human empathy levels.[sup][7][/sup] When plotted on a graph, the reactions are indicated by a steep decrease followed by a steep increase (hence the "valley" part of the name) in the areas where anthropomorphism is closest to reality.

[quintessentone]

I'm not so sure about that. What about trends of beauty over the ages, such as women putting poisonous white powder on their faces (zombie/corpse look), or Japanese women with white faces then painting their teeth black with a mixture of coal dust, or other peoples binding baby's heads for an elongated look, elongated necks, etc.

I might be on the wrong track here, but isn't beauty in the eye of the beholder and it's been proven that Neanderthals interbred with Homo Sapiens, so when does survival or necessity become the driving factors and not aesthetics or some perverted fetish, I guess is what I am asking?

[Kurokage]

I'm not so sure about that. What about trends of beauty over the ages, such as women putting poisonous white powder on their faces (zombie/corpse look), or Japanese women with white faces then painting their teeth black with a mixture of coal dust, or other peoples binding baby's heads for an elongated look, elongated necks, etc.

I might be on the wrong track here, but isn't beauty in the eye of the beholder and it's been proven that Neanderthals interbred with Homo Sapiens, so when does survival or necessity become the driving factors and not aesthetics or some perverted fetish, I guess is what I am asking?

An interesting point but they still look 'human' even with odd makeup, the fact that nearly all humans suffer from this fear of the unfamiliar or odd looking almost human is what's different to your other suggestions.

[quintessentone]

An interesting point but they still look 'human' even with odd makeup, the fact that nearly all humans suffer from this fear of the unfamiliar or odd looking almost human is what's different to your other suggestions.

So are we taking about specifically robots becoming more human-looking that starts to cause this fear? Like in a Blade Runner scenario? I've seen the new sex robots and they look very human and men seem very happy with purchasing and using them.

[BeyondKnowledge]

If there is a fear of the almost human, then how are the almost humans in fantasy explained? There are mermaids, satyrs, ipotains, centaurs, etc.. all are part human and some look very human in the face mad part of their body depending on the depiction. And even the Twilight series depects almost human monsters as love interests, werewolves and vampires. There is even many fantasies about being transformed into not quite human beings. 

AI has now has the rendering of images and videos very lifelike for the humans in some cases. Some don't like that because there is no talent involved in making the end product. Others love the images and videos. 

I think it is a fear of artificial humans more than human like beings. Fear of the replacements. The funny fealing of seeing a picture or video of something you like but it is just too perfect. 

Now take that one step farther with robots and suddenly something in front of you is too perfect. Even the programed imperfections are too perfect.

[Kurokage]

If there is a fear of the almost human, then how are the almost humans in fantasy explained? There are mermaids, satyrs, ipotains, centaurs, etc.. all are part human and some look very human in the face mad part of their body depending on the depiction. And even the Twilight series depects almost human monsters as love interests, werewolves and vampires. There is even many fantasies about being transformed into not quite human beings. 

AI has now has the rendering of images and videos very lifelike for the humans in some cases. Some don't like that because there is no talent involved in making the end product. Others love the images and videos. 

I think it is a fear of artificial humans more than human like beings. Fear of the replacements. The funny fealing of seeing a picture or video of something you like but it is just too perfect. 

Now take that one step farther with robots and suddenly something in front of you is too perfect. Even the programed imperfections are too perfect.

The majority of those examples you picked, either have very human features or are the complete opposite though.
If you read the articles and check out the graph (which is why it's called the uncanny valley) there's this little trough in the middle, were this eerie feeling at looking at something like us but isn't us creeps us out. In some of the depictions of the graph they do include fantasy creatures and such.

Some the creatures you've suggested would be on the left in the graph.

[Runespider]

The issue with the human evolution idea is that the effect goes beyond just depictions of human, but triggers with animals and landscapes and so on as well. 
 For example this research from 2018:
Is there an uncanny valley of virtual animals? A quantitative and qualitative investigation

 Putting aside that there's very little evidence of us interacting violently with other early humans,  but evidence of us living in the same area does exist. As well as hybridization. The modern genetics is sometimes used to try to prove the interactions were violence, but  it's better explained by the mix of genetics causing fertility issues that affected one gender more.

Personally I tend to feel it's just an issue of our brains not really being evolved to deal with artificial images that aren't exactly right, plus cultural familiarity.

[Kurokage]

 Putting aside that there's very little evidence of us interacting violently with other early humans,  but evidence of us living in the same area does exist. As well as hybridization. The modern genetics is sometimes used to try to prove the interactions were violence, but  it's better explained by the mix of genetics causing fertility issues that affected one gender more.

There's not much evidence for either it being peaceful or aggressive but bones have been found that were cannibalized.  I imagine it could have been some where in the middle.

The 'uncanny valley' vide is there with things like fear of the darkness, and creepy crawlies. Something that's part of our DNA so to speak, a very early protection against the other.

[Runespider]

There's not much evidence for either it being peaceful of aggressive but bones have been found that were cannibalized.  I imagine it could have been some where in the middle.


​​​​​

​
The 'uncanny valley' vide is there with things like fear of the darkness, and creepy crawlies. Something that's part of our DNA so to speak, a very early protection against the other.

 To the first, sure. But you also see it at places like Jamestown or as a cultural practice towards the dead. 
 The interesting thing about, for example, our relationship with Neanderthals is that we didn't actually compete with each other, at least for most of our coexistence. We had different niches, demonstrated by our tools. Our direct ancestors going after smaller prey and Neanderthals going after larger mega fauna
​​​. But that's only where we coeexisted. 
 
Meanwhile the idea of it being a warning system doesn't really hold. As I pointed out we are very familiar with it being triggered by human figures because of how common they are in media. But you get similar effects from animals or landscapes. That leans into it not being an evolved response but the method being used to produce the image.

[Kurokage]

 To the first, sure. But you also see it at places like Jamestown or as a cultural practice towards the dead. 
 The interesting thing about, for example, our relationship with Neanderthals is that we didn't actually compete with each other, at least for most of our coexistence. We had different niches, demonstrated by our tools. Our direct ancestors going after smaller prey and Neanderthals going after larger mega fauna
​​​. But that's only where we coeexisted. 
 
Meanwhile the idea of it being a warning system doesn't really hold. As I pointed out we are very familiar with it being triggered by human figures because of how common they are in media. But you get similar effects from animals or landscapes. That leans into it not being an evolved response but the method being used to produce the image.

There's a few theories but the more recent ones tend to lean more to what I posted here.

Efforts toward identifying the cause of the uncanny valley are similarly varied. One study found that what most unnerved participants was the illusion of human consciousness that near-human likeness causes—the prospect that a robot could think and feel as humans do. Another theory credits primal instinct. Humans are programmed by evolution to favour mates that appear strong and healthy, and a humanoid robot’s unnatural movement may signal disease and danger on a subconscious level. Yet another idea suggests that it is the ambiguity between human and inhuman that is most disturbing.

As to Neanderthals, they were a more violent and aggressive species compared to us from more recent theories and evidence...
https://www.sciencealert.com/how-neander...-000-years

Predatory land mammals are territorial, especially pack-hunters. Like lions, wolves and Homo sapiens, Neanderthals were cooperative big-game hunters. These predators, sitting atop the food chain, have few predators of their own, so overpopulation drives conflict over hunting grounds. Neanderthals faced the same problem; if other species didn't control their numbers, conflict would have.
This territoriality has deep roots in humans. Territorial conflicts are also intense in our closest relatives, chimpanzees. Male chimps routinely gang up to attack and kill males from rival bands, a behaviour strikingly like human warfare.

The Neanderthal resistance
War leaves a subtler mark in the form of territorial boundaries. The best evidence that Neanderthals not only fought but excelled at war, is that they met us and weren't immediately overrun. Instead, for around 100,000 years, Neanderthals resisted modern human expansion.
 
Why else would we take so long to leave Africa? Not because the environment was hostile but because Neanderthals were already thriving in Europe and Asia.
It's exceedingly unlikely that modern humans met the Neanderthals and decided to just live and let live. If nothing else, population growth inevitably forces humans to acquire more land, to ensure sufficient territory to hunt and forage food for their children.
Even after primitive Homo sapiens broke out of Africa 200,000 years ago, it took over 150,000 years to conquer Neanderthal lands.