Random thought

[David64]

Under the current laws, I firmly believe if you take out a loan to go to college, you have to repay it. You knew what you were getting into when you signed that paper and it's just like taking a loan out for a car or house, no one is going to come along and say "Oh what the hell, just forget it"

On the other hand....I believe they should change the tax laws and if your job requires a college degree, you should be able to list it as a business expense and be totally tax deductible.

[Maxmars]

I spent a long time working in the higher education system...it was a miraculous conjunction of willful blindness.

I commented that we (the University) were asking these students to compromise their financial futures, and it was unclear why...

I was informed that "Most well-paying jobs requires higher education."

Being the perpetual "under foot dissenter," I asked a Director what his "degree" was "in."

The answer was not something I expected....  it was not directly related to the Directorship, it was not even pertinent to academia or public services, or the law...

I did not mean the answer to craft a judgement... but apparently, that was how it was received...

I was alluding to the fact that a person trained in political science can find themselves leading a team of engineers, or a Librarian scientist may thrive in the food industry... that "degrees" are simply a "receipt" in today's culture...
That "degrees" are plain and simple social currency and not an indicator of anything other than satisfying a University administration... ending up in debt assuming you can find employment.

But it never got there... it became presumed by those to whom I was speaking collectively, that I meant to imply that if you don't have a degree specific to your function - it proves it was a waste of time and money...  (I'm am honestly certain that I never cultivated that sentiment with these people... it was their presumption, or that is what they expected as a group.)

My position had never been to denigrate or reject the idea of a degree... it was the way the studies were 'branded.'
I had told them that it seemed that the multiplicity of degree "transformations" over time turned it from a meaningful asset to the student, into 'self-image candy' marketed to their ambitions...  In fact, Universities went "full marketing" and immediately lost their "prestige" in the process.

I think they found it utterly presumptuous for someone like me to say... (I have no "social currency" upon which to proclaim 'standing' amongst the "layer" in which I had been invited to speak...)

I have an interesting time of it...

I agree that if a condition on employment is a university debt-load, it must be re-considered in the balance as explicitly in support of a tax-payer's economic career... it could be argued as a "legitimate business expense."

But you know that's all "by decree" right?  No amount of reasoning will sway the "bank loan' culture... unless it makes them more money, it's out of the question.

[ArMaP]

In Portugal we can deduct 60% of education expenses from the personal tax, but with a limit.

Although some universities may be very expensive, student loans are not common in Portugal.

[BomSquad]

When the money is guaranteed to the university, there is no incentive to curb costs. 

This is what happens when the government basically starts cosigning all education loans guaranteeing only the student and the tax payer are on the hook for the loan, and the university can never experience a loss from a failure in payment.

Having a degree does open doors to employment, but it isn't the only way. With hard work, my wits and experience and my high school diploma, I've managed to claw my way up to Director of IT in a company with an annual revenue of $100m and I've been told by my boss, the CIO, that I am their succession plan when they retire. We'll see when that happens. I'm not holding my breath, but I am cautiously hopeful. 

If I had that piece of paper, I might have been able to get to where I am 10-15 years sooner, but only because those doors would have opened easier, not because I needed any additional education to get where I am.

[Harte]

40% of all student debt belongs to people that never finished a degree. That's 72% of ALL student loan debt defaults.
THAT is a failure on the part of the Department of Education (one of hundreds of failures of the DOE.)
Pretending college is for everyone put those people in this bind.

Harte

[UltraBudgie]

In Portugal we can deduct 60% of education expenses from the personal tax, but with a limit.

Although some universities may be very expensive, student loans are not common in Portugal.

In the US you can deduct up to $2500 each year for qualified education expenses.

You can also deduct the interest paid on student loans. I helped a relative pay off a student loan in full last year, and they got about a $2000 deduction for doing so.

You can't retroactively deduct anything for education expenses incurred in the past, however. Expenses must be from with the current tax-year.

I think it would make sense if student loan principle payments were tax-deductable, as well as interest.

But that would somewhat negate the whole purpose of student loans, as a trap to bind the taxpayer into the workforce system by dint of economic necessity, haha.

[argentus]

Under the current laws, I firmly believe if you take out a loan to go to college, you have to repay it. You knew what you were getting into when you signed that paper and it's just like taking a loan out for a car or house, no one is going to come along and say "Oh what the hell, just forget it"

On the other hand....I believe they should change the tax laws and if your job requires a college degree, you should be able to list it as a business expense and be totally tax deductible.

Agree, and that should apply to your certifications, continuing education and all the associated expenses for keeping current.   30+ years ago, my CE and certs were a tax-deductible business expense, but not the lost wages, travel and accommodations expenses.   Sometimes I had to travel hundreds of miles to keep my shiz current.

[argentus]

I spent a long time working in the higher education system...it was a miraculous conjunction of willful blindness.

I commented that we (the University) were asking these students to compromise their financial futures, and it was unclear why...

I was informed that "Most well-paying jobs requires higher education."

Being the perpetual "under foot dissenter," I asked a Director what his "degree" was "in."

The answer was not something I expected....  it was not directly related to the Directorship, it was not even pertinent to academia or public services, or the law...

I did not mean the answer to craft a judgement... but apparently, that was how it was received...

I was alluding to the fact that a person trained in political science can find themselves leading a team of engineers, or a Librarian scientist may thrive in the food industry... that "degrees" are simply a "receipt" in today's culture...
That "degrees" are plain and simple social currency and not an indicator of anything other than satisfying a University administration... ending up in debt assuming you can find employment.

But it never got there... it became presumed by those to whom I was speaking collectively, that I meant to imply that if you don't have a degree specific to your function - it proves it was a waste of time and money...  (I'm am honestly certain that I never cultivated that sentiment with these people... it was their presumption, or that is what they expected as a group.)

My position had never been to denigrate or reject the idea of a degree... it was the way the studies were 'branded.'
I had told them that it seemed that the multiplicity of degree "transformations" over time turned it from a meaningful asset to the student, into 'self-image candy' marketed to their ambitions...  In fact, Universities went "full marketing" and immediately lost their "prestige" in the process.

I think they found it utterly presumptuous for someone like me to say... (I have no "social currency" upon which to proclaim 'standing' amongst the "layer" in which I had been invited to speak...)

I have an interesting time of it...

I agree that if a condition on employment is a university debt-load, it must be re-considered in the balance as explicitly in support of a tax-payer's economic career... it could be argued as a "legitimate business expense."

But you know that's all "by decree" right?  No amount of reasoning will sway the "bank loan' culture... unless it makes them more money, it's out of the question.

Agree with your sentiment.    I have to confess that with my first student loan, in addition to tuition, I bought a 500W Peavey bandit combo, which subsequently more than paid for itself.