Intense psychological turmoil - and encounters

[Sirius]

If your already having an anxiety attack from the title, welcome to the thread and we are going on a astral journey today.

I have been looking for an opportunity to broach the subject in a somewhat sane and responsible way and finally found the answer in a book.

At some point in your life you will have an "awakening experience", a heightened state of consciousness. There are many better ways to reach nirvana than intense psychological turmoil, but it is a way and a powerful experience.

Clearing the air for a moment, "intense psychological turmoil" is a wide range of things.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/intl/blo...-shift-ups

Finally, there is "sudden wakefulness," which involves an instantaneous and dramatic identity shift, and occurs most frequently in response to intense psychological turmoil, such as bereavement, loss, failure, or severe stress.

In my research, I have found that sudden awakening in response to turmoil (or ‘transformation through turmoil’ as I sometimes call it) is far from uncommon. Unfortunately, however, it is often undetected or misinterpreted. This is because sometimes sudden awakening occurs in an intensely energetic and explosive form, and causes some psychological disturbances.

As a result, "sudden energetic awakening" (as I call it) is frequently misdiagnosed as a form of psychosis. For example, in my Ph.D. research, there were five clear cases of "sudden energetic awakening," four of whom were seen by psychiatrists, given medication and/or confined to psychiatric hospitals.

As it happens there is a moment of intense psychological turmoil that I'm happy to share without fear or ridicule and that is the experience during sleep paralysis where we encounter entities.

Another place of intense psychological turmoil and encounters is when you call out to a spiritual savior  -- for whatever reason from an exorcism to something as "mundane" as heartbreak.

Intense Psychological Turmoil is physical not just psychological, chemistry is involved.  The whole person is in a state, paralyzed or manic. What is breathing and blood ph like? Why is that important? Because you are channeling or in the process of starting.

It is possible to induce an encounter by mimicking the physical aspects but you have to listen to the drums.

[Sirius]

[Sirius]

Dancing on burning coals is sure to bring intense psychological turmoil and a interesting ritual is Nestinarstvo, or Bulgarian fire dancing as it's more popularly known.
https://ich.unesco.org/en/RL/nestinarstv...gari-00191
The fire-dancers perform barefoot on coals where they are able to foretell the future.  Shifts in altered states of conciseness brings shifts in time and it would be interesting to know what deity or spirit plays or played a role in Nestinarstvo for a ritual always involves contact.

If we want more than simple scrying we have to look towards Dionysus, his rituals and the maenads. Intoxication plays a role but intoxication alone does not bring a manic state.  That is where you need music and dancing.

Fasting is interesting because that brings a whole host of physical and psychological changes with turmoil.

I don't think this is news to anyone, literally every religion has some kind of ritual.  What is not obvious is that some of these rituals includes physical components that brings forth entities through intense psychological turmoil.

[Maxmars]

I might be misunderstanding, but are we referring to the exposure to intense psychological turmoil to facilitate or prompt a spiritual experience?

Ritualization is, in my opinion, only a facet of practice... many people appear to have achieved spiritual 'awakening' via stress and even pain.  The methods vary with the means...

I first saw this in "primitive" shamanistic practices, especially those that lead communities.  Whatever rationale or narrative evoked, it always seems to culminate in something that could easily be described as psychological turmoil... from dancing until exhaustion, to walking on coals, to painful piercing or burning, extended strenuous effort to the point of collapse... even sleep deprivation (hello Lunatics,) dangerous fasting, etc... all the way to get to the point of 'perceptual explosion.'

But inherently, there is some discrepancy in the idea of risking injury to achieve the state desired.  The damage to oneself can be irreversible.

[Sirius]

I might be misunderstanding, but are we referring to the exposure to intense psychological turmoil to facilitate or prompt a spiritual experience?

Ritualization is, in my opinion, only a facet of practice... many people appear to have achieved spiritual 'awakening' via stress and even pain.  The methods vary with the means...

I first saw this in "primitive" shamanistic practices, especially those that lead communities.  Whatever rationale or narrative evoked, it always seems to culminate in something that could easily be described as psychological turmoil... from dancing until exhaustion, to walking on coals, to painful piercing or burning, extended strenuous effort to the point of collapse... even sleep deprivation (hello Lunatics,) dangerous fasting, etc... all the way to get to the point of 'perceptual explosion.'

But inherently, there is some discrepancy in the idea of risking injury to achieve the state desired.  The damage to oneself can be irreversible.

Yes but without risking injury and for healing instead.  Pausing how we get there, this "awakening experiences", it's your brain healing. People generally turn their lives around after meeting a god or becoming one with the universe.

[Sirius]

It's easy to ridicule primitives dancing around a fire because your not having the experience.  Just another church scam, weirdo's falling down on the floor having seizures etc.  You get guys that travels all the way to the amazon jungle to trip on DMT with a shaman, you don't have to do that... Just get some mates and drums, make a fire..  It's ancient magic, works all over.

One of the things this leads to is that when someone tells me they called out to Jesus and he saved them, I believe it.

You called him in a moment where you had intense turmoil, you met the conditions physiologically and physically. You summoned an entity and that entity is Jesus and now you are going to have an awakening experience with him.  This is your path now.

What happens when you call something else? Well then you have that awakening experience and follow a different path.

What happens when you call nothing, but something comes? This is the interesting one and I would like to hear peoples experience or opinions.

[Sirius]

The Baining people are interesting, they straight up just get possessed by animal spirits as part of initiation.  I'm not clear on the difference between elemental forces and those that are animal. Maybe small groups of people links with animal spirits and the larger the population gets the more forces gets involved until you end up with Neptune and Zeus.

I have had encounters with animals spirits, my understanding is that they are guides and also sometimes guardians.

"The Baining firedance is also a rite of passage for initiating young men into adulthood; during the ceremony the dancers are considered to be possessed by anthropomorphised animal spirits or masalai that enhance the dancer's own masculinity"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baining_people

[midicon]

Edit to remove post.

[Maxmars]

Please don't misunderstand my use of the word "primitive"... I meant it not as a criticism, but one of distinction. 

For me "modern" usually means "needlessly complicated beyond reason, festooned with frippery and dunsels;" where "primitive" is alternately, more "direct, simple."

Nowadays, many seek the undisciplined use of drugs to approximate the shift of perception which might facilitate the approach of inner peace... but it's all the same end point (ostensibly.)   Hence, the long-held traditional characterization of the experience of imbibing 'spirits.'

The key to the nature of the experience is always "intent."  So when we are 'surprised' at some perceptual revelation, it is usually by a defining personal perspective... or a lack thereof.

I mean not to pretend to be in a position to judge, and I try my best not to... because intimate experiences such as these are in the realm of the participants, not the observers.